2023 NCAA Volleyball Selection Show

[bbg95]

Nov 27, 2023 10:33:10 GMT -5 vbshrink said:

Nov 27, 2023 9:24:52 GMT -5 avid 2.0 said:

Well, TCU has two RPI 150+ losses, to WVU and Cincinnati. They also fizzled a little bit down the stretch, going 4-6 over their last 10.

On the plus side, they have one top 25 RPI win (Utah State, in September), two wins over Baylor, a win over FSU, and a win over TAMU.

TCU's RPI (42) was also a lot higher. I'd have to take a closer look, but I get the sense that this committee relied heavily on RPI. I think RPI is also 100% the reason why Stephen F. Austin got into the tournament while Kansas State is watching from home. RPI can't go away quickly enough.

[pavsec5row10]

Nov 27, 2023 0:39:09 GMT -5 Fight On! said:

Nov 27, 2023 0:24:44 GMT -5 pavsec5row10 said:

They clearly did, but your opinion is again noted.  Fight off.

Classic.
No facts.
I am happy to entertain your perspective but you don’t have one apparently. You just want to be rude.

lol, nice projection, but as I said F off. 

[n00b]

Nov 27, 2023 9:57:09 GMT -5 avid 2.0 said:

Nov 27, 2023 9:43:41 GMT -5 BigDigEnergy said:

Sure if you look at it that way but I wonder/doubt that the committee would go that far and plus that is how RPI group the teams.

Anyway, I cannot wait to see the potential match up between Creighton and MN  

that is exactly my point, they should! The margins between these teams are so small. They have all of the information, use it. I just want consistency. 

I hope they lose to Utah State ;) 

I don't think it's as inconsistent as you're making it out to be. The starting point has always been RPI. How much to deviate from that ranking will always be subjective. I agree that #36 Stephen F Austin had nothing other than that ranking to lean on. Except this year, a second rating system was added because coaches clamored for it, and SFA was also in the Top 40 of that one.

I agree that it was wrong that the committee didn't invite the team ranked 59/49 over the team ranked 36/39. However, I disagree that it is wildly inconsistent.

[n00b]

Nov 27, 2023 10:40:23 GMT -5 cardinalvolleyball said:

Nov 26, 2023 18:42:23 GMT -5 odinaka said:

How did A&M get in?
This committee must be on some special brownies from Colorado 🤯

team A:
2 top 25 wins
4 top 50 wins
6-1 vs 50-100
worst loss 203

team B:
3 top 25wins
6 top 50 wins
0-3 vs 50-100
worst loss 158

team C:
0 top 25 wins
0 top 50 wins
3-1 vs 50-100
worst loss 74

Hint, one team did not make it

What were the final RPI ranks of those three teams?

[trojansc]

Nov 27, 2023 3:33:25 GMT -5 jayj79 said:

Nov 26, 2023 18:45:17 GMT -5 @madden55 said:

Kansas state getting left out is legit insane. 3 sweeps over 3 seeded teams

and losses to teams with RPIs of 148 and 156 (and 75, 71, 61), giving KState an RPI of 58.
while SFA's worst loss was to RPI 76, with their other losses to RPI 32 or better teams, giving SFA an RPI of 36

Not really all that surprising that they got in.

Nov 26, 2023 18:57:39 GMT -5 trojansc said:

They lost 1 match outside the Top 50. Texas A&M was legit.

another team that only lost 1 match outside the Top 50: SFA

But Texas A&M beat a Top 16 seed and had 6 total Top 50 wins, so, apples and oranges.. You have to stretch it to *76* for SFA to get a 'win'. I know you're just here for the mid-majors though, so, you should probably argue for Drake, who at least beat somebody relevant. And Drake didn't lose to a team sub-100.     

[trojansc]

Nov 27, 2023 4:26:39 GMT -5 jayj79 said:

comparing tournament selection and RPI:
top 43 RPI all made it in
44 NC State and 46 St Johns were passed over; while 45 Miami (FL) and 47 Georgia were included
and according the the figstats table, both St Johns and Georgia have 0.5929 for their RpiPct (though perhaps St Johns has the edge beyond 4 decimal places, I dunno)

So pretty darn close to a straight RPI cutoff

Which is what the committee was trending away from (and what the committee chair came on an interview and said before the selections were actually made).

She stated "it's a common misconception that we rely heavily on RPI to determine our rankings". Sounds like BS to me?

[pavsec5row10]

Nov 27, 2023 9:41:56 GMT -5 volleyguy said:

Let’s not forget that Keegan Cook is currently President of the AVCA. I don’t know what impact that had, but let’s not forget it.

...and KBB is the President-elect. 

Maybe they secretly conspired to get the committee to put their teams in the same sub-regional to have the secret baton passing ceremony at Sokol after the match. 

[volleyguy]

Nov 27, 2023 11:07:31 GMT -5 pavsec5row10 said:

Nov 27, 2023 9:41:56 GMT -5 volleyguy said:

Let’s not forget that Keegan Cook is currently President of the AVCA. I don’t know what impact that had, but let’s not forget it.

...and KBB is the President-elect. 

Maybe they secretly conspired to get the committee to put their teams in the same sub-regional to have the secret baton passing ceremony at Sokol after the match. 

Way to spill the beans, Mister.

[trojansc]

Nov 27, 2023 2:27:47 GMT -5 rainyvolleyball said:

I've only read the past couple of pages ... people are actually saying that Kansas State should have gotten in over Minnesota? K-State had eight losses to teams ranked 26 or lower while Minnesota had two. In what world does K-State deserve the nod over Minnesota? You can't lose to so many not-as-good teams and feel you deserve to be in. Conversely, Minnesota's losses were almost all to really good teams (i.e. top-25 teams). I mean, there's a reason Minnesota's RPI is a *lot* better than Kansas State's.

Minnesota's profile is not bad. Not when you're simply considering if they should get into the field.

When you compare the two H2H:

Wins: Much much better by K-State.
RPI/KPI is split - RPI says Minnesota is better, KPI says K-State is better
Sub-100 losses: Same.

The reason why Minnesota's RPI is better is because of their opponents W/L records. RPI is not calculated simply by strength of team - it is calculated by strength of record. Those are two different things. That's why playing Stephen F. Austin is better for your raw RPI than playing Kentucky (even though Kentucky is a top 10 team). And that's a problem.     

[Deleted]

Nov 27, 2023 10:42:17 GMT -5 jaypak said:

Nov 26, 2023 18:21:16 GMT -5 @madden55 said:

Creighton not gonna make the sweet 16 again 😭😭😭

Why not?  Minnesota's going to stop them?  Utah State?  Or Colgate?

Minnesota will lol

[trojansc]

Nov 27, 2023 9:14:54 GMT -5 skolgophers said:

Nov 26, 2023 23:55:57 GMT -5 avid 2.0 said:

I dont see how im being a hater? 

K-State and Minnesota had similar profiles. 

K-State was 3-3 vs top 25, Minnesota was 1-10. K State was 6-6 vs the top 50, Minnesota was 3-10. Both had a top 10 win. Both had two bad losses. 

I wouldnt want to play KState either lol 

I know what you’re saying. My point is: I had been following the Bracketology thread and didn’t see this much outrage when MN wasn’t really considered “last 4 in” at that time. Why now? Because KState didn’t get in? Look at others who were also in…. TCU(MN won), SFA(enough said), Baylor(MN won). Idk why MN is the one who didn’t deserve it or only got in because of their name. That’s, frankly, BS.

Minnesota's KPI would have had them out of the tournament. I had them in because of H2H wins versus TCU, Baylor, and also the big win over Oregon. That was enough for me - but it wasn't *that* convincing.

If they said KPI=RPI, which they did, it doesn't explain why Minnesota wsan't last 4 in. I was skeptical the committee would actually say KPI=RPI, which I didn't factor into Bracketology, I discounted KPI. The committee says they didn't, so, that doesn't exactly make sense in the case of Minnesota.

[Deleted]

It’s crazy bc I feel like even if minny lost that 5th set to Oregon that they woulda gotten in lmao. At like 15-13 on the season

[c4ndlelight]

Nov 27, 2023 11:09:13 GMT -5 @madden55 said:

Nov 27, 2023 10:42:17 GMT -5 jaypak said:

Why not?  Minnesota's going to stop them?  Utah State?  Or Colgate?

Minnesota will lol

If Creighton can't get out of its own subregional this time, they should just stop putting in a bid to host and just hope they land in a soft travel-restricted subregional.

[Deleted]

Nov 27, 2023 11:13:31 GMT -5 c4ndlelight said:

Nov 27, 2023 11:09:13 GMT -5 @madden55 said:

Minnesota will lol

If Creighton can't get out of its own subregional this time, they should just stop putting in a bid to host and just hope they land in a soft travel-restricted subregional.

this is yalls fault that mommy made the tournament

[trojansc]

Nov 27, 2023 10:43:47 GMT -5 bbg95 said:

Nov 27, 2023 10:33:10 GMT -5 vbshrink said:

Well, TCU has two RPI 150+ losses, to WVU and Cincinnati. They also fizzled a little bit down the stretch, going 4-6 over their last 10.

On the plus side, they have one top 25 RPI win (Utah State, in September), two wins over Baylor, a win over FSU, and a win over TAMU.

TCU's RPI (42) was also a lot higher. I'd have to take a closer look, but I get the sense that this committee relied heavily on RPI. I think RPI is also 100% the reason why Stephen F. Austin got into the tournament while Kansas State is watching from home. RPI can't go away quickly enough.

The problem is it's inconsistent year to year. The committee for a stretch kept penalizing teams for their non-conference schedule, then, they reward teams with high RPI's who didn't beat (and in some cases) didn't play anyone.

If I'm 2019 South Dakota - I'm pretty pissed right now. They had an RPI of 38 - had a slightly better win (#64 Wyoming) and had a 29-2 record and were left out of the tournament. Doesn't make sense?

The committee chair said 'they could not give an at-large bid to a team without top 50 wins'. Which has been historically accurate, even if their RPI was really good. There have been exceptions, and surprisingly they are *more* recent than later. Which n00b mentioned the other day it seemed the committee was straying away from pure RPI, and I'm not sure. High Point, Rice (which was a little unique), and Stephen F. Austin have gotten at-large bids in the past 6 years with no quality wins. That's not good for the sport.

You can game the RPI - it is up to committee members to recognize when teams do not earn a bid. I'm still trying to wrap my mind around why you have to beat 'someone' to get into the Tournament.