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Post by hwnstunner on Aug 11, 2024 16:57:58 GMT -5
I usually have no problem with your posts that typically others go off on. But this, I 100% disagree. You are making a general statement off of ONE offseason in between a year that we graduated six and have three 2025s and one 2026 committed. It's like saying Hawaii is a bad school because they missed the NCAA in 1992, despite making NCAAs every other year. Also, to say NIL deals have little to no effect on the potential recruit or transfer is perplexing. This isn't even including the impeding 18 scholarship limit for women's volleyball. 2024 we have iPhone. 2000 we had pagers. To compare how Hawaii should be in 2024 women's volleyball to how things were in 2000 - shoot even just 2020 - is unfair. Why do people always mischaracterize my comments? I did NOT say "NIL deals have little to no effect on the potential recruit or transfer" I said "It can't be only about (NIL) money". Not even the same thing! I really don't understand the point you're trying to make regarding "It's like saying Hawaii is a bad school because they missed the NCAA in 1992, despite making NCAAs every other year." I never said any such thing! All I'm saying is I don't understand how we only have 13 players on roster when she had the whole offseason to try to get players from the portal! She knew she was losing our all-world player Amber and that we would be thin at MB and also lost Paula yet she didn't get one experienced transfer in the offseasn WHY? Is it laziness as some have pointed out? Is it players don't want to play for Robyn? What's the reason? I really don't care to hear lame excuses (geography, lack of resources, etc.) for the poor choices the coaching staff is making.... So back to my initial thought, are all the recruiting issues you are surfacing for JUST this season or are you saying it's been throughout Ah Mow's tenure? Because your posts seem to be a generalization of Ah Mow's seven years. Your comment literally lean that way. So if you are saying all that for just this year, warranted and fair. If you are making a generalization of seven years plus the recruiting classes to come, that's where it's clearly not the case. I get you are a season ticket holder, so good for you. You have a bank shot of "support" that many of us don't for various reasons. But again, we are seeing a one year lapse in recruiting. So how can anyone make a general statement of the state of the current staff's overall coaching/recruiting success? I'm just trying to understand your POV, because I've never thought your posts have been unwarranted and I typically see where you are coming from
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Post by hapaguy on Aug 11, 2024 16:58:43 GMT -5
2021 NCAA 1st round loss 2022 NCAA 2nd round loss π¬ππ» Itβs honestly not even worth bothering with the negative nancys at this point. They are all welcome to leave the fanbase if a potentially challenging season scares them off that easily. You're just like those nincompoops that if you criticize something about our country you tell them "if you don't love it leave it". That's so stupid! You can love something but still criticize it and want it to be better! I've been a Men's and Women's Volleyball season ticket holder since I moved back to Hawaii after college in 1987 and I've also been a past VP and Booster Club Board Member and I'm not going anywhere! I have a right to my opinion just like anyone else on here.
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Post by VT Karen on Aug 11, 2024 17:05:46 GMT -5
I usually have no problem with your posts that typically others go off on. But this, I 100% disagree. You are making a general statement off of ONE offseason in between a year that we graduated six and have three 2025s and one 2026 committed. It's like saying Hawaii is a bad school because they missed the NCAA in 1992, despite making NCAAs every other year. Also, to say NIL deals have little to no effect on the potential recruit or transfer is perplexing. This isn't even including the impeding 18 scholarship limit for women's volleyball. 2024 we have iPhone. 2000 we had pagers. To compare how Hawaii should be in 2024 women's volleyball to how things were in 2000 - shoot even just 2020 - is unfair. Why do people always mischaracterize my comments? I did NOT say "NIL deals have little to no effect on the potential recruit or transfer" I said "It can't be only about (NIL) money". Not even the same thing! I really don't understand the point you're trying to make regarding "It's like saying Hawaii is a bad school because they missed the NCAA in 1992, despite making NCAAs every other year." I never said any such thing! All I'm saying is I don't understand how we only have 13 players on roster when she had the whole offseason to try to get players from the portal! She knew she was losing our all-world player Amber and that we would be thin at MB and also lost Paula yet she didn't get one experienced transfer in the offseasn WHY? Is it laziness as some have pointed out? Is it players don't want to play for Robyn? What's the reason? I really don't care to hear lame excuses (geography, lack of resources, etc.) for the poor choices the coaching staff is making.... If you think that geography and lack of resources is a lame excuse then therein lies the problem with your stance if you have one at all outside of probably just disliking Robyn. I respectfully tried to debate you on your points but you offer nearly nothing and just come off as passive aggressive. But calling facts a lame excuse is really going to set you up to be bitter with everything that's going on and will probably block you from enjoying the season even if there are incremental improvements.
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Post by hapaguy on Aug 11, 2024 17:21:45 GMT -5
Why do people always mischaracterize my comments? I did NOT say "NIL deals have little to no effect on the potential recruit or transfer" I said "It can't be only about (NIL) money". Not even the same thing! I really don't understand the point you're trying to make regarding "It's like saying Hawaii is a bad school because they missed the NCAA in 1992, despite making NCAAs every other year." I never said any such thing! All I'm saying is I don't understand how we only have 13 players on roster when she had the whole offseason to try to get players from the portal! She knew she was losing our all-world player Amber and that we would be thin at MB and also lost Paula yet she didn't get one experienced transfer in the offseasn WHY? Is it laziness as some have pointed out? Is it players don't want to play for Robyn? What's the reason? I really don't care to hear lame excuses (geography, lack of resources, etc.) for the poor choices the coaching staff is making.... So back to my initial thought, are all the recruiting issues you are surfacing for JUST this season or are you saying it's been throughout Ah Mow's tenure? Because your posts seem to be a generalization of Ah Mow's seven years. Your comment literally lean that way. So if you are saying all that for just this year, warranted and fair. If you are making a generalization of seven years plus the recruiting classes to come, that's where it's clearly not the case. I get you are a season ticket holder, so good for you. You have a bank shot of "support" that many of us don't for various reasons. But again, we are seeing a one year lapse in recruiting. So how can anyone make a general statement of the state of the current staff's overall coaching/recruiting success? If you look back at what started this conversation it's the 13 player roster so yes, it's about this season. Robyn and staff knew they were going to lose Amber and then they lost Paula but they had the WHOLE OFFSEASON to find experienced replacements and what did they come up with? BUPKIS. So they have barely enough players to scrimmage themselves and heaven help us if someone gets injured as we have almost no depth. Now if you want to talk about Robyn's recruiting in general since she's been HC I'd give her a "C" grade. She's had some ups and downs and many of the players that she's recruited over the years didn't pan out. Lot's of players that have transferred out that she - and the UH program in general, hyped big time. Yes, she's had some good players, BVS, Amber, Kate, but she's also had many, many, players leave early for various reasons (some injuries/medical): Hannah Hellvig, Jolie Rasmussen, Kyra Hanawahine, Kamalei Krug, Siena Springborn, Martyna Leoniak, Ilayda Demirtas, Annika de Geode, Mia Johnson, Colby Lane, Paule Guersching, to name a few... I do like Robyn's recruits like Stella, Leyva, Adri, Mili, and Maddie and the recruits she's named for the future. Let's hope and keep our fingers crossed that past is not prologue and they stick around...
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Post by hwnstunner on Aug 11, 2024 17:28:32 GMT -5
So back to my initial thought, are all the recruiting issues you are surfacing for JUST this season or are you saying it's been throughout Ah Mow's tenure? Because your posts seem to be a generalization of Ah Mow's seven years. Your comment literally lean that way. So if you are saying all that for just this year, warranted and fair. If you are making a generalization of seven years plus the recruiting classes to come, that's where it's clearly not the case. I get you are a season ticket holder, so good for you. You have a bank shot of "support" that many of us don't for various reasons. But again, we are seeing a one year lapse in recruiting. So how can anyone make a general statement of the state of the current staff's overall coaching/recruiting success? If you look back at what started this conversation it's the 13 player roster so yes, it's about this season. Robyn and staff knew they were going to lose Amber and then they lost Paula but they had the WHOLE OFFSEASON to find experienced replacements and what did they come up with? BUPKIS. So they have barely enough players to scrimmage themselves and heaven help us if someone gets injured as we have almost no depth. Now if you want to talk about Robyn's recruiting in general since she's been HC I'd give her a "C" grade. She's had some ups and downs and many of the players that she's recruited over the years didn't pan out. Lot's of players that have transferred out that she - and the UH program in general, hyped big time. Yes, she's had some good players, BVS, Amber, Kate, but she's also had many, many, players leave early for various reasons (some injuries/medical): Hannah Hellvig, Jolie Rasmussen, Kyra Hanawahine, Kamalei Krug, Siena Springborn, Martyna Leoniak, Ilayda Demirtas, Annika de Geode, Mia Johnson, Colby Lane, Paule Guersching, to name a few... I do like Robyn's recruits like Stella, Leyva, Adri, Mili, and Maddie and the recruits she's named for the future. Let's hope and keep our fingers crossed that past is not prologue and they stick around... Noted. I agree this season is perplexing and a bit disappointing recruiting wise.
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Post by hapaguy on Aug 11, 2024 17:29:48 GMT -5
Why do people always mischaracterize my comments? I did NOT say "NIL deals have little to no effect on the potential recruit or transfer" I said "It can't be only about (NIL) money". Not even the same thing! I really don't understand the point you're trying to make regarding "It's like saying Hawaii is a bad school because they missed the NCAA in 1992, despite making NCAAs every other year." I never said any such thing! All I'm saying is I don't understand how we only have 13 players on roster when she had the whole offseason to try to get players from the portal! She knew she was losing our all-world player Amber and that we would be thin at MB and also lost Paula yet she didn't get one experienced transfer in the offseasn WHY? Is it laziness as some have pointed out? Is it players don't want to play for Robyn? What's the reason? I really don't care to hear lame excuses (geography, lack of resources, etc.) for the poor choices the coaching staff is making.... If you think that geography and lack of resources is a lame excuse then therein lies the problem with your stance if you have one at all outside of probably just disliking Robyn. I respectfully tried to debate you on your points but you offer nearly nothing and just come off as passive aggressive. But calling facts a lame excuse is really going to set you up to be bitter with everything that's going on and will probably block you from enjoying the season even if there are incremental improvements. Karen, I've already explained to you the reason why I think that those are lame excuses so I'm not sure why you claim that I "offer nearly nothing and just come off as passive aggressive" but since you didn't get it or understand it here's why I say that: Geography and lack of resources HAS ALWAYS BEEN A FACTOR THAT UH WILL HAVE TO DEAL WITH. Not only in volleyball but UH athletics in general. If you still don't understand let me put it to you this way: nothing has changed in that regard so it's NOT a valid point to bring up to excuse what's happening NOW. We've ALWAYS had that problem and probably always will. IMHO there is NO excuse for having a 13 player roster.
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Post by babybacksets on Aug 11, 2024 18:05:02 GMT -5
Itβs honestly not even worth bothering with the negative nancys at this point. They are all welcome to leave the fanbase if a potentially challenging season scares them off that easily. You're just like those nincompoops that if you criticize something about our country you tell them "if you don't love it leave it". That's so stupid! You can love something but still criticize it and want it to be better! I've been a Men's and Women's Volleyball season ticket holder since I moved back to Hawaii after college in 1987 and I've also been a past VP and Booster Club Board Member and I'm not going anywhere! I have a right to my opinion just like anyone else on here. And if I think your opinion is stupid then I have the right to voice that or what is the problem? Iβm not interested in insulting you I just think itβs ridiculous how you and others are scapegoating the coaching staff not to mention lacking the self awareness that this exact scenario could likely be happening to several other programs that you DONT follow as closely. Youβve obviously had Shoji the majority of your time as a fan and rather than thinking of ways to be supportive of the staff, you and others are just pulling negative assumptions out of your backside despite the evidence that tells you otherwise.
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Post by noblesol on Aug 11, 2024 19:43:38 GMT -5
What I'd do as Athletic Director: - The football fanbase is under 15k and trending down. And it was trending down when they played at Aloha Stadium. With the NCAA P4 settlement, it's clear that UH Manoa will never be Tier-I Div-I FBS. They'll struggle to remain in the MW Conference. Take the Red Pill, confront reality. Shut down the football program which bleeds red about $2 million/year. That will also shave about $12 million/year off the total athletic budget. That will take pressure off the other programs to carry the dead weight of a football program without a future. It will negate any need to further toss money into the Ching pit or build a new stadium destined for delay, cost overruns, and more deficits. The State can build low-cost housing at Halawa instead of a stadium that's doomed to fail. - With ~ 80 men scholarships gone, balance the Title IX scales by making cuts in Womens Basketball, which runs about a $1 million/year deficit. Cut about half their scholarships and an assistant coach. Bring in a young head coach paid at the low end of the scale. Women's basketball is a big money loser and even when they have successful teams, their crowds average ~1,000. Even when they play well enough to win the BWC, they are gone in the first round of the NCAA. And their best teams are still hard to watch. The skillset of WB in the BWC is excruciatingly low. - Invest in Men's Baseball. Hawaii produces some excellent local talent, and even average baseball teams have drawn well. Instead of dumping money with no future returns into football, make upgrades to the baseball facilities and up their recruiting budget. A winning baseball program will draw media dollars and attendance and get it into the black financially. - Invest in MVB and WVB. Both should be generating budget surpluses with good steady recruiting. Hire an assistant for WVB that can recruit and promote. - Invest in WBVB. Hawaii should be in the top ten of the nation in WBVB each year, and perennially within reach of the top four. - Invest in Women's Water Polo. Hawai'i should be perennially in the top four of the nation with budget support and better promotion. - Men's Basketball needs a new head coach. Ganot's best year was with talent he didn't recruit. He keeps a staff of assistants that sometimes have been greater in number than his bench players.
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Post by wahinefan on Aug 11, 2024 20:46:19 GMT -5
What is it with Hawaii born Head Coaches? Was just looking at Pepperdine's Roster, they only have 8 to 9 players listed on their roster. Do Hawaii born Head Coaches like really small roster sizes?
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Post by HawaiiMongoose on Aug 11, 2024 22:58:35 GMT -5
What I'd do as Athletic Director: - The football fanbase is under 15k and trending down. And it was trending down when they played at Aloha Stadium. With the NCAA P4 settlement, it's clear that UH Manoa will never be Tier-I Div-I FBS. They'll struggle to remain in the MW Conference. Take the Red Pill, confront reality. Shut down the football program which bleeds red about $2 million/year. That will also shave about $12 million/year off the total athletic budget. That will take pressure off the other programs to carry the dead weight of a football program without a future. It will negate any need to further toss money into the Ching pit or build a new stadium destined for delay, cost overruns, and more deficits. The State can build low-cost housing at Halawa instead of a stadium that's doomed to fail. - With ~ 80 men scholarships gone, balance the Title IX scales by making cuts in Womens Basketball, which runs about a $1 million/year deficit. Cut about half their scholarships and an assistant coach. Bring in a young head coach paid at the low end of the scale. Women's basketball is a big money loser and even when they have successful teams, their crowds average ~1,000. Even when they play well enough to win the BWC, they are gone in the first round of the NCAA. And their best teams are still hard to watch. The skillset of WB in the BWC is excruciatingly low. - Invest in Men's Baseball. Hawaii produces some excellent local talent, and even average baseball teams have drawn well. Instead of dumping money with no future returns into football, make upgrades to the baseball facilities and up their recruiting budget. A winning baseball program will draw media dollars and attendance and get it into the black financially. - Invest in MVB and WVB. Both should be generating budget surpluses with good steady recruiting. Hire an assistant for WVB that can recruit and promote. - Invest in WBVB. Hawaii should be in the top ten of the nation in WBVB each year, and perennially within reach of the top four. - Invest in Women's Water Polo. Hawai'i should be perennially in the top four of the nation with budget support and better promotion. - Men's Basketball needs a new head coach. Ganot's best year was with talent he didn't recruit. He keeps a staff of assistants that sometimes have been greater in number than his bench players. I think you're giving up on football too easily and too soon. Historically UH's football program has been a net cash contributor to the overall athletic program. It's bleeding right now but that's because fan support has been eroded by some bad coaching choices (Chow and later Graham) and revenue potential is constrained by the terrible stadium situation (Aloha Stadium had already lost its appeal as place to watch a game even before it was shut down, and Ching is much worse with respect to not only capacity but also accessibility, comfort, and quality of fan experience). Now we have a coach that appears to be moving the program in the right direction and is worthy of support, and there's at least the appearance of a viable path to the team having a much larger and more appealing venue to showcase its progress if we can be patient for a few more seasons. I believe a winning football team playing in a new stadium will bring back fans and turn the red ink to black. Football also has benefited the university from a national branding/awareness perspective in a way no other sport has, even volleyball. Except in California, UH has a higher national profile than other Big West schools and that's in large part because it's had streaks of success playing football at the FBS level. As someone who grew up in the Midwest and visits family there periodically, you may have had experiences similar to mine when I've traveled to the East Coast wearing UH branded gear. Before the 2000s people who saw me would express surprise that Hawaii had a university and laughingly ask whether students could major in surfing. After UH's football visibility increased they would bring up June Jones, Colt Brennan, and the run-and-shoot offense. That effect has faded with the passage of time but regular appearances of the UH football team on national television still help maintain awareness that far-away Hawaii has a first-class state flagship university with resources, traditions, and legitimacy comparable to its Mainland counterparts. Finally we shouldn't discount how UH football could benefit from upcoming changes to the college football landscape. The expanded CFP playoff will financially benefit power conference schools disproportionately, but G5 FBS schools like UH will also receive substantially higher CFP payouts. The House settlement will allow power conference schools to lock up elite football talent with revenue sharing, but also cap their ability to monopolize talent by limiting total football rosters to 105, ending the stockpiling of talented walk-ons and perhaps creating more trickle-down to G5 programs. The House settlement will also restrict the value of booster-funded NIL deals to the fair market value of services provided by the athletes, which should eliminate some of the NIL hyper-inflation that's making it so difficult for UH to compete in the transfer portal. In short, it's premature to throw in the towel on football when there's a chance the program will actually perform better in the new ecosystem and be able to contribute more to the athletic department's bottom line.
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Post by noblesol on Aug 12, 2024 0:53:00 GMT -5
What I'd do as Athletic Director: - The football fanbase is under 15k and trending down. And it was trending down when they played at Aloha Stadium. With the NCAA P4 settlement, it's clear that UH Manoa will never be Tier-I Div-I FBS. They'll struggle to remain in the MW Conference. Take the Red Pill, confront reality. Shut down the football program which bleeds red about $2 million/year. That will also shave about $12 million/year off the total athletic budget. That will take pressure off the other programs to carry the dead weight of a football program without a future. It will negate any need to further toss money into the Ching pit or build a new stadium destined for delay, cost overruns, and more deficits. The State can build low-cost housing at Halawa instead of a stadium that's doomed to fail. - With ~ 80 men scholarships gone, balance the Title IX scales by making cuts in Womens Basketball, which runs about a $1 million/year deficit. Cut about half their scholarships and an assistant coach. Bring in a young head coach paid at the low end of the scale. Women's basketball is a big money loser and even when they have successful teams, their crowds average ~1,000. Even when they play well enough to win the BWC, they are gone in the first round of the NCAA. And their best teams are still hard to watch. The skillset of WB in the BWC is excruciatingly low. - Invest in Men's Baseball. Hawaii produces some excellent local talent, and even average baseball teams have drawn well. Instead of dumping money with no future returns into football, make upgrades to the baseball facilities and up their recruiting budget. A winning baseball program will draw media dollars and attendance and get it into the black financially. - Invest in MVB and WVB. Both should be generating budget surpluses with good steady recruiting. Hire an assistant for WVB that can recruit and promote. - Invest in WBVB. Hawaii should be in the top ten of the nation in WBVB each year, and perennially within reach of the top four. - Invest in Women's Water Polo. Hawai'i should be perennially in the top four of the nation with budget support and better promotion. - Men's Basketball needs a new head coach. Ganot's best year was with talent he didn't recruit. He keeps a staff of assistants that sometimes have been greater in number than his bench players. I think you're giving up on football too easily and too soon. Historically UH's football program has been a net cash contributor to the overall athletic program. It's bleeding right now but that's because fan support has been eroded by some bad coaching choices (Chow and later Graham) and revenue potential is constrained by the terrible stadium situation (Aloha Stadium had already lost its appeal as place to watch a game even before it was shut down, and Ching is much worse with respect to not only capacity but also accessibility, comfort, and quality of fan experience). Now we have a coach that appears to be moving the program in the right direction and is worthy of support, and there's at least the appearance of a viable path to the team having a much larger and more appealing venue to showcase its progress if we can be patient for a few more seasons. I believe a winning football team playing in a new stadium will bring back fans and turn the red ink to black. Football also has benefited the university from a national branding/awareness perspective in a way no other sport has, even volleyball. Except in California, UH has a higher national profile than other Big West schools and that's in large part because it's had streaks of success playing football at the FBS level. As someone who grew up in the Midwest and visits family there periodically, you may have had experiences similar to mine when I've traveled to the East Coast wearing UH branded gear. Before the 2000s people who saw me would express surprise that Hawaii had a university and laughingly ask whether students could major in surfing. After UH's football visibility increased they would bring up June Jones, Colt Brennan, and the run-and-shoot offense. That effect has faded with the passage of time but regular appearances of the UH football team on national television still help maintain awareness that far-away Hawaii has a first-class state flagship university with resources, traditions, and legitimacy comparable to its Mainland counterparts. Finally we shouldn't discount how UH football could benefit from upcoming changes to the college football landscape. The expanded CFP playoff will financially benefit power conference schools disproportionately, but G5 FBS schools like UH will also receive substantially higher CFP payouts. The House settlement will allow power conference schools to lock up elite football talent with revenue sharing, but also cap their ability to monopolize talent by limiting total football rosters to 120, ending the stockpiling of talented walk-ons and perhaps creating more trickle-down to G5 programs. The House settlement will also restrict the value of booster-funded NIL deals to the fair market value of services provided by the athletes, which should eliminate some of the NIL hyper-inflation that's making it so difficult for UH to compete in the transfer portal. In short, it's premature to throw in the towel on football when there's a chance the program will actually perform better in the new ecosystem and be able to contribute more to the athletic department's bottom line. Good response. Where I differ is that I don't view the P4 settlement as the permanent future landscape. Standby for more lawsuits, and at some point someone introduces legislation. Where it all ends, well, legal and lobbyist budgets will dictate. It'll be counting on luck to expect UH Manoa football will be better off structurally in the future. They aren't driving where this all ends up, and the final financial and competitive landscape is more likely to leave them behind than reward them with a small apportionment of talent and dollars. As for a new stadium, it's already been long delayed and already well into comedic. The $400 million authorized likely isn't going to finish the job. It hasn't even been enough to start the job. And when finally built over budget and long delayed, it won't be the schools stadium. It's revenue will go to the State authority/private enterprise set up to run it. What will they charge? What revenue trickles to UH Manoa will be a share of attendance, maybe some concessions. With a fanbase that draws maybe 10,000.... well, I strongly suspect the numbers won't add up. At best it's going to be a longshot, a roll of the dice, a gamble that at some point UH Manoa football stops losing money in the millions annually. Some magical accounting might allow them to show a balanced budget somewhere down the line. Perhaps they shift and shave expenses to some other line, some other program. Perhaps they over attribute some general revenue stream to the football line. But those types of moves usually just kick the can a bit and spread and increase the eventual pain when finally faced with the inevitable. Better to face the pain squarely, now.
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Post by HawaiiMongoose on Aug 12, 2024 1:24:20 GMT -5
I think you're giving up on football too easily and too soon. Historically UH's football program has been a net cash contributor to the overall athletic program. It's bleeding right now but that's because fan support has been eroded by some bad coaching choices (Chow and later Graham) and revenue potential is constrained by the terrible stadium situation (Aloha Stadium had already lost its appeal as place to watch a game even before it was shut down, and Ching is much worse with respect to not only capacity but also accessibility, comfort, and quality of fan experience). Now we have a coach that appears to be moving the program in the right direction and is worthy of support, and there's at least the appearance of a viable path to the team having a much larger and more appealing venue to showcase its progress if we can be patient for a few more seasons. I believe a winning football team playing in a new stadium will bring back fans and turn the red ink to black. Football also has benefited the university from a national branding/awareness perspective in a way no other sport has, even volleyball. Except in California, UH has a higher national profile than other Big West schools and that's in large part because it's had streaks of success playing football at the FBS level. As someone who grew up in the Midwest and visits family there periodically, you may have had experiences similar to mine when I've traveled to the East Coast wearing UH branded gear. Before the 2000s people who saw me would express surprise that Hawaii had a university and laughingly ask whether students could major in surfing. After UH's football visibility increased they would bring up June Jones, Colt Brennan, and the run-and-shoot offense. That effect has faded with the passage of time but regular appearances of the UH football team on national television still help maintain awareness that far-away Hawaii has a first-class state flagship university with resources, traditions, and legitimacy comparable to its Mainland counterparts. Finally we shouldn't discount how UH football could benefit from upcoming changes to the college football landscape. The expanded CFP playoff will financially benefit power conference schools disproportionately, but G5 FBS schools like UH will also receive substantially higher CFP payouts. The House settlement will allow power conference schools to lock up elite football talent with revenue sharing, but also cap their ability to monopolize talent by limiting total football rosters to 120, ending the stockpiling of talented walk-ons and perhaps creating more trickle-down to G5 programs. The House settlement will also restrict the value of booster-funded NIL deals to the fair market value of services provided by the athletes, which should eliminate some of the NIL hyper-inflation that's making it so difficult for UH to compete in the transfer portal. In short, it's premature to throw in the towel on football when there's a chance the program will actually perform better in the new ecosystem and be able to contribute more to the athletic department's bottom line. Good response. Where I differ is that I don't view the P4 settlement as the permanent future landscape. Standby for more lawsuits, and at some point someone introduces legislation. Where it all ends, well, legal and lobbyist budgets will dictate. It'll be counting on luck to expect UH Manoa football will be better off structurally in the future. They aren't driving where this all ends up, and the final financial and competitive landscape is more likely to leave them behind than reward them with a small apportionment of talent and dollars. As for a new stadium, it's already been long delayed and already well into comedic. The $400 million authorized likely isn't going to finish the job. It hasn't even be enough to start the job. And when finally built over budget and long delayed, it won't be the schools stadium. It's revenue will go to the State authority/private enterprise set up to run it. What will they charge? What revenue trickles to UH Manoa will be a share of attendance, maybe some concessions. With a fanbase that draws maybe 10,000.... well, I strongly suspect the numbers won't add up. At best it's going to be a longshot, a roll of the dice, a gamble that at some point UH Manoa football stops losing money in the millions annually. Some magical accounting might allow them to show a balanced budget somewhere down the line. Perhaps they shift and shave expenses to some other line, some other program. Perhaps they over attribute some general revenue stream to the football line. But those types of moves usually just kick the can a bit and spread and increase the eventual pain when finally faced with the inevitable. Better to face the pain squarely, now. Respect your views though my outlook differs. And the truth is that we're both operating on limited information. Things should be a little clearer in a few weeks when details of the proposal submitted by AHDP in response to the NASED RFP are revealed.
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Post by VT Karen on Aug 12, 2024 2:24:49 GMT -5
If you think that geography and lack of resources is a lame excuse then therein lies the problem with your stance if you have one at all outside of probably just disliking Robyn. I respectfully tried to debate you on your points but you offer nearly nothing and just come off as passive aggressive. But calling facts a lame excuse is really going to set you up to be bitter with everything that's going on and will probably block you from enjoying the season even if there are incremental improvements. Karen, I've already explained to you the reason why I think that those are lame excuses so I'm not sure why you claim that I "offer nearly nothing and just come off as passive aggressive" but since you didn't get it or understand it here's why I say that: Geography and lack of resources HAS ALWAYS BEEN A FACTOR THAT UH WILL HAVE TO DEAL WITH. Not only in volleyball but UH athletics in general. If you still don't understand let me put it to you this way: nothing has changed in that regard so it's NOT a valid point to bring up to excuse what's happening NOW. We've ALWAYS had that problem and probably always will. IMHO there is NO excuse for having a 13 player roster. And I agree with you that it's always been a problem but my point is that the disparity is becoming even greater when you look at the entire picture that is the current NCAA. The rich are getting richer and Hawaii has always been behind. With the introduction of NIL and the relaxed restrictions on the transfer portal, the athletes are now able to transfer out to a places where they could start earning money. Maybe a change in the guard would help mitigate the 13 women roster issue in the future but they need the money to buy the services of better coaches and now players. Money is talking louder than it ever has before in the NCAA. I think we agree on things more than it seems, I'm just in the camp of enjoy it while it's here though I've also been underwhelmed by the recruiting and the development of some players.
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Post by VT Karen on Aug 12, 2024 2:31:34 GMT -5
What I'd do as Athletic Director: - The football fanbase is under 15k and trending down. And it was trending down when they played at Aloha Stadium. With the NCAA P4 settlement, it's clear that UH Manoa will never be Tier-I Div-I FBS. They'll struggle to remain in the MW Conference. Take the Red Pill, confront reality. Shut down the football program which bleeds red about $2 million/year. That will also shave about $12 million/year off the total athletic budget. That will take pressure off the other programs to carry the dead weight of a football program without a future. It will negate any need to further toss money into the Ching pit or build a new stadium destined for delay, cost overruns, and more deficits. The State can build low-cost housing at Halawa instead of a stadium that's doomed to fail. - With ~ 80 men scholarships gone, balance the Title IX scales by making cuts in Womens Basketball, which runs about a $1 million/year deficit. Cut about half their scholarships and an assistant coach. Bring in a young head coach paid at the low end of the scale. Women's basketball is a big money loser and even when they have successful teams, their crowds average ~1,000. Even when they play well enough to win the BWC, they are gone in the first round of the NCAA. And their best teams are still hard to watch. The skillset of WB in the BWC is excruciatingly low. - Invest in Men's Baseball. Hawaii produces some excellent local talent, and even average baseball teams have drawn well. Instead of dumping money with no future returns into football, make upgrades to the baseball facilities and up their recruiting budget. A winning baseball program will draw media dollars and attendance and get it into the black financially. - Invest in MVB and WVB. Both should be generating budget surpluses with good steady recruiting. Hire an assistant for WVB that can recruit and promote. - Invest in WBVB. Hawaii should be in the top ten of the nation in WBVB each year, and perennially within reach of the top four. - Invest in Women's Water Polo. Hawai'i should be perennially in the top four of the nation with budget support and better promotion. - Men's Basketball needs a new head coach. Ganot's best year was with talent he didn't recruit. He keeps a staff of assistants that sometimes have been greater in number than his bench players. It is crazy to think of Hawaii not having a football team. There have been times where they have been such a source of pride for the state and they give our local boys an opportunity to play at home in front of friends and family. But yes, the financials aren't great and the projections don't look great either for them. Tough. I pray the Warriors have a great season to kickstart a comeback but even if they do, will that be enough?
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Post by noblesol on Aug 12, 2024 2:46:38 GMT -5
What I'd do as Athletic Director: - The football fanbase is under 15k and trending down. And it was trending down when they played at Aloha Stadium. With the NCAA P4 settlement, it's clear that UH Manoa will never be Tier-I Div-I FBS. They'll struggle to remain in the MW Conference. Take the Red Pill, confront reality. Shut down the football program which bleeds red about $2 million/year. That will also shave about $12 million/year off the total athletic budget. That will take pressure off the other programs to carry the dead weight of a football program without a future. It will negate any need to further toss money into the Ching pit or build a new stadium destined for delay, cost overruns, and more deficits. The State can build low-cost housing at Halawa instead of a stadium that's doomed to fail. - With ~ 80 men scholarships gone, balance the Title IX scales by making cuts in Womens Basketball, which runs about a $1 million/year deficit. Cut about half their scholarships and an assistant coach. Bring in a young head coach paid at the low end of the scale. Women's basketball is a big money loser and even when they have successful teams, their crowds average ~1,000. Even when they play well enough to win the BWC, they are gone in the first round of the NCAA. And their best teams are still hard to watch. The skillset of WB in the BWC is excruciatingly low. - Invest in Men's Baseball. Hawaii produces some excellent local talent, and even average baseball teams have drawn well. Instead of dumping money with no future returns into football, make upgrades to the baseball facilities and up their recruiting budget. A winning baseball program will draw media dollars and attendance and get it into the black financially. - Invest in MVB and WVB. Both should be generating budget surpluses with good steady recruiting. Hire an assistant for WVB that can recruit and promote. - Invest in WBVB. Hawaii should be in the top ten of the nation in WBVB each year, and perennially within reach of the top four. - Invest in Women's Water Polo. Hawai'i should be perennially in the top four of the nation with budget support and better promotion. - Men's Basketball needs a new head coach. Ganot's best year was with talent he didn't recruit. He keeps a staff of assistants that sometimes have been greater in number than his bench players. It is crazy to think of Hawaii not having a football team. There have been times where they have been such a source of pride for the state and they give our local boys an opportunity to play at home in front of friends and family. But yes, the financials aren't great and the projections don't look great either for them. Tough. I pray the Warriors have a great season to kickstart a comeback but even if they do, will that be enough? Maybe a little less crazy after reading this article found in the school paper about a year ago: www.manoanow.org/kaleo/why-no-one-cares-about-uh-football/article_2bf0ab18-5d91-11ee-84f9-6b41a4242159.html
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