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Post by thelblive on Aug 9, 2024 15:12:33 GMT -5
The Long Beach collective marketed that they made $125,000 in one night this past year
$7000 tuition multiplied by every student-athlete from the US on their roster
That 1 night can give nearly 18 of the team full-tuition
I am sure there is more being fundraised too
Interesting
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Post by volleycoach2310 on Aug 9, 2024 15:16:50 GMT -5
The Long Beach collective marketed that they made $125,000 in one night this past year $7000 tuition multiplied by every student-athlete from the US on their roster That 1 night can give nearly 18 of the team full-tuition I am sure there is more being fundraised too Interesting Tuition is just one small piece of the cost, though… The housing in California isn’t cheap. Living and eating in California also not cheap. So even if you give them a full tuition scholarship that leaves quite a bit of money for these kids to come up with. |
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Post by BeachbytheBay on Aug 9, 2024 15:18:03 GMT -5
The Long Beach collective marketed that they made $125,000 in one night this past year $7000 tuition multiplied by every student-athlete from the US on their roster That 1 night can give nearly 18 of the team full-tuition I am sure there is more being fundraised too Interesting that is great, but $7000 is not really a full ride, although in the current world of D1 MVB, it's fantastic, especially when Stanford or USC tuition is like $60k. out of state is $19,000 books and room and board etc are at leat $20-25 k |
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Post by volleycoach2310 on Aug 9, 2024 15:20:03 GMT -5
the bottom line is this there are six schools that would be on the list for 18 player full coverage. USC, Stanford, Penn State, UCLA, BYU, & Ohio State that is where likely every NCAA champion will come from beginning 2030 the 'old' system was resulting in steady growth in programs because the cost of entry for MVB and being competitive between those 6 and the rest by 2030, those 6 will band togehter, probably as a Big 10 conference with affiliates, to make a MVB super conference. they'll end up playing each other 4 times in the regular seasons, and sprinkle other matches the money disparity and structural issues Hawaii and Beach especiallly will have to overcome will be immense. maybe Hawaii and Beach can get to 12 full schollies and recruit the best internationally and maintain things the other thing is can the Big West MVB conference survive? It's a the bare minimum # of teams, and any thought Davis or POly would add MVB probably just got torpedoed long term. The Big West might not be a conference in 5 years for all we know. someone can lay out why the reasoning above is flawed, would enjoy seeing that reasoning I was kind of thinking this initially, too that the big football schools would have an advantage here… But the more I’ve talked and heard about it it concerns me that that money will now go to those extra football scholarships, and while they might have the money for the men’s programs because of title IX they won’t be able to give it to them. They will have to give it to female sports. So while beach volleyball for women could flourish, for men I could see programs getting completely cut. If Ohio State has an option of giving 30 more guys a football scholarship or 18 guys a volleyball scholarship unfortunately I could see them going with football. Extremely sad but follow the money. I even heard things like in four years there might only be four men’s sports left at these schools… How I hope those people are wrong because the thought of them not having men’s volleyball breaks my heart! |
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Post by BeachbytheBay on Aug 9, 2024 15:22:10 GMT -5
The Long Beach collective marketed that they made $125,000 in one night this past year $7000 tuition multiplied by every student-athlete from the US on their roster That 1 night can give nearly 18 of the team full-tuition I am sure there is more being fundraised too Interesting Tuition is just one small piece of the cost, though… The housing in California isn’t cheap. Living and eating in California also not cheap. So even if you give them a full tuition scholarship that leaves quite a bit of money for these kids to come up with. that's true, just for Long Beach a contributing VB player from Socal can commute, go to Beach, ahve tuition paid so the cost compared to playing for UCLA/USC/Standord might be $200k+ less over 4 years to go to Beach, which is a massive financial decision to weigh, it's been a huge advantage for Beach in the current 4.5 schollie era. 18 schollies will change all that. the 6th or 10th best player at Beach now might be ok being the 12th best player at USC if his USC degree costs less or same now, when there's not a huge finacial savings that exists presently for going to Beach |
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Post by BeachbytheBay on Aug 9, 2024 15:24:17 GMT -5
the bottom line is this there are six schools that would be on the list for 18 player full coverage. USC, Stanford, Penn State, UCLA, BYU, & Ohio State that is where likely every NCAA champion will come from beginning 2030 the 'old' system was resulting in steady growth in programs because the cost of entry for MVB and being competitive between those 6 and the rest by 2030, those 6 will band togehter, probably as a Big 10 conference with affiliates, to make a MVB super conference. they'll end up playing each other 4 times in the regular seasons, and sprinkle other matches the money disparity and structural issues Hawaii and Beach especiallly will have to overcome will be immense. maybe Hawaii and Beach can get to 12 full schollies and recruit the best internationally and maintain things the other thing is can the Big West MVB conference survive? It's a the bare minimum # of teams, and any thought Davis or POly would add MVB probably just got torpedoed long term. The Big West might not be a conference in 5 years for all we know. someone can lay out why the reasoning above is flawed, would enjoy seeing that reasoning I was kind of thinking this initially, too that the big football schools would have an advantage here… But the more I’ve talked and heard about it it concerns me that that money will now go to those extra football scholarships, and while they might have the money for the men’s programs because of title IX they won’t be able to give it to them. They will have to give it to female sports. So while beach volleyball for women could flourish, for men I could see programs getting completely cut. If Ohio State has an option of giving 30 more guys a football scholarship or 18 guys a volleyball scholarship unfortunately I could see them going with football. Extremely sad but follow the money. I even heard things like in four years there might only be four men’s sports left at these schools… How I hope those people are wrong because the thought of them not having men’s volleyball breaks my heart! then why did they push for such excissive #s of schollies. Like really volleybal needs 18 and 12 or 14 would not have sufficed? just across the board the nubmers are frankly flabbergasting, and it may be to allow what is the football pigs to get more and more. maybe that saying will come true. pigs get fed, hogs get slaughtered. one can only hope that is the outcome for these P4s in the end. F 'em |
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Post by volleycoach2310 on Aug 9, 2024 15:30:17 GMT -5
I was kind of thinking this initially, too that the big football schools would have an advantage here… But the more I’ve talked and heard about it it concerns me that that money will now go to those extra football scholarships, and while they might have the money for the men’s programs because of title IX they won’t be able to give it to them. They will have to give it to female sports. So while beach volleyball for women could flourish, for men I could see programs getting completely cut. If Ohio State has an option of giving 30 more guys a football scholarship or 18 guys a volleyball scholarship unfortunately I could see them going with football. Extremely sad but follow the money. I even heard things like in four years there might only be four men’s sports left at these schools… How I hope those people are wrong because the thought of them not having men’s volleyball breaks my heart! then why did they push for such excissive #s of schollies. Like really volleybal needs 18 and 12 or 14 would not have sufficed? just across the board the nubmers are frankly flabbergasting, and it may be to allow what is the football pigs to get more and more. maybe that saying will come true. pigs get fed, hogs get slaughtered. one can only hope that is the outcome for these P4s in the end. F 'em Yes, I was in girls volleyball for a long time and there were always 12 full rides for D1 and when I started doing more boys the 4.5 number was like what! But due to title IX, unfortunately the guys are getting screwed more and more. I don’t like it because football basically gets all the male money and the other sports get completely screwed. I understand it from a financial picture because football obviously brings in the most, but I just wish there were other ways to fund these programs! As far as why they pushed for this many in men’s volleyball, I really don’t know! |
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Post by volleycoach2310 on Aug 9, 2024 15:32:42 GMT -5
Tuition is just one small piece of the cost, though… The housing in California isn’t cheap. Living and eating in California also not cheap. So even if you give them a full tuition scholarship that leaves quite a bit of money for these kids to come up with. that's true, just for Long Beach a contributing VB player from Socal can commute, go to Beach, ahve tuition paid so the cost compared to playing for UCLA/USC/Standord might be $200k+ less over 4 years to go to Beach, which is a massive financial decision to weigh, it's been a huge advantage for Beach in the current 4.5 schollie era. 18 schollies will change all that. the 6th or 10th best player at Beach now might be ok being the 12th best player at USC if his USC degree costs less or same now, when there's not a huge finacial savings that exists presently for going to Beach I understand that, I have lots of players that have gone to play in college, some in Cali…but even though Long Beach tuition is extremely cheap unless you can find kids who live within about an hour of the campus commuting could be really rough! The traffic in that area can be unbearable so you are selecting now from a very small pool of men. I know there’s a lot of great players in California but not all of them want to go to Long Beach. |
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Post by BeachbytheBay on Aug 9, 2024 15:37:49 GMT -5
that's true, just for Long Beach a contributing VB player from Socal can commute, go to Beach, ahve tuition paid so the cost compared to playing for UCLA/USC/Standord might be $200k+ less over 4 years to go to Beach, which is a massive financial decision to weigh, it's been a huge advantage for Beach in the current 4.5 schollie era. 18 schollies will change all that. the 6th or 10th best player at Beach now might be ok being the 12th best player at USC if his USC degree costs less or same now, when there's not a huge finacial savings that exists presently for going to Beach I understand that, I have lots of players that have gone to play in college, some in Cali…but even though Long Beach tuition is extremely cheap unless you can find kids who live within about an hour of the campus commuting could be really rough! The traffic in that area can be unbearable so you are selecting now from a very small pool of men. I know there’s a lot of great players in California but not all of them want to go to Long Beach. I wouldn't say it's that small. from Manhattan Beach to Newport, traffic to from Long Beach isn't bad, and for college it can be flexible. and that area from Manhattan Beach to Newport is loaded with VB talent at both high school and Jucos. just saying, and using Clark Godbold as an example what if he got a 0.5 schollie to Beach vs. USC. so his family is weighing a $100k decision (and now in 2024 that might be a $200k decision) so now he can just get a full ride to USC, the decision gets dicier since his family doesn't have to fork out a penny to go to USC - does he still go to Beach? don't kid yourself, UCLA has a great advantage recruiting being public, and now both USC & UCLA may have a really huge advantage over Beach/Irvine/Hawaii going forward unless those 3 find at least another $500k a year to keep up, and good luck with that. |
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Post by Not Me on Aug 9, 2024 15:58:13 GMT -5
I was kind of thinking this initially, too that the big football schools would have an advantage here… But the more I’ve talked and heard about it it concerns me that that money will now go to those extra football scholarships, and while they might have the money for the men’s programs because of title IX they won’t be able to give it to them. They will have to give it to female sports. So while beach volleyball for women could flourish, for men I could see programs getting completely cut. If Ohio State has an option of giving 30 more guys a football scholarship or 18 guys a volleyball scholarship unfortunately I could see them going with football. Extremely sad but follow the money. I even heard things like in four years there might only be four men’s sports left at these schools… How I hope those people are wrong because the thought of them not having men’s volleyball breaks my heart! then why did they push for such excissive #s of schollies. Like really volleybal needs 18 and 12 or 14 would not have sufficed? just across the board the nubmers are frankly flabbergasting, and it may be to allow what is the football pigs to get more and more. maybe that saying will come true. pigs get fed, hogs get slaughtered. one can only hope that is the outcome for these P4s in the end. F 'em The people who came up with these limits were lawyers. Not the ncaa. Not people who are familiar with the sports. I’m sure many non-revenue sports are having the same conversations. |
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Post by volleycoach2310 on Aug 9, 2024 17:03:16 GMT -5
I understand that, I have lots of players that have gone to play in college, some in Cali…but even though Long Beach tuition is extremely cheap unless you can find kids who live within about an hour of the campus commuting could be really rough! The traffic in that area can be unbearable so you are selecting now from a very small pool of men. I know there’s a lot of great players in California but not all of them want to go to Long Beach. I wouldn't say it's that small. from Manhattan Beach to Newport, traffic to from Long Beach isn't bad, and for college it can be flexible. and that area from Manhattan Beach to Newport is loaded with VB talent at both high school and Jucos. just saying, and using Clark Godbold as an example what if he got a 0.5 schollie to Beach vs. USC. so his family is weighing a $100k decision (and now in 2024 that might be a $200k decision) so now he can just get a full ride to USC, the decision gets dicier since his family doesn't have to fork out a penny to go to USC - does he still go to Beach? don't kid yourself, UCLA has a great advantage recruiting being public, and now both USC & UCLA may have a really huge advantage over Beach/Irvine/Hawaii going forward unless those 3 find at least another $500k a year to keep up, and good luck with that. You still may be missing the Title IX implications. Football may get the money at USC and beach volleyball for women and men’s could get cut? |
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Post by BeachbytheBay on Aug 9, 2024 18:15:23 GMT -5
I wouldn't say it's that small. from Manhattan Beach to Newport, traffic to from Long Beach isn't bad, and for college it can be flexible. and that area from Manhattan Beach to Newport is loaded with VB talent at both high school and Jucos. just saying, and using Clark Godbold as an example what if he got a 0.5 schollie to Beach vs. USC. so his family is weighing a $100k decision (and now in 2024 that might be a $200k decision) so now he can just get a full ride to USC, the decision gets dicier since his family doesn't have to fork out a penny to go to USC - does he still go to Beach? don't kid yourself, UCLA has a great advantage recruiting being public, and now both USC & UCLA may have a really huge advantage over Beach/Irvine/Hawaii going forward unless those 3 find at least another $500k a year to keep up, and good luck with that. You still may be missing the Title IX implications. Football may get the money at USC and beach volleyball for women and men’s could get cut? doubt it, but we shall see Football is really the out of control monster. It's made universities into pro sports franchises. why anyone outside of OSU alums and residents of Columbus would route for OSU is beyond me, but so are a lot of things |
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Post by wilbur on Aug 9, 2024 18:58:21 GMT -5
I was kind of thinking this initially, too that the big football schools would have an advantage here… But the more I’ve talked and heard about it it concerns me that that money will now go to those extra football scholarships, and while they might have the money for the men’s programs because of title IX they won’t be able to give it to them. They will have to give it to female sports. So while beach volleyball for women could flourish, for men I could see programs getting completely cut. If Ohio State has an option of giving 30 more guys a football scholarship or 18 guys a volleyball scholarship unfortunately I could see them going with football. Extremely sad but follow the money. I even heard things like in four years there might only be four men’s sports left at these schools… How I hope those people are wrong because the thought of them not having men’s volleyball breaks my heart! then why did they push for such excissive #s of schollies. Like really volleybal needs 18 and 12 or 14 would not have sufficed? just across the board the nubmers are frankly flabbergasting, and it may be to allow what is the football pigs to get more and more. maybe that saying will come true. pigs get fed, hogs get slaughtered. one can only hope that is the outcome for these P4s in the end. F 'em decouple the scholarship limit with the roster limit and it will make more sense. They are trying to solve a puzzle that has to do with laws the recent lawsuits have identified preventing the NCAA from making a ton of money and not paying the revenue generating athletes. Removing scholarship limits somehow fixes something and has nothing to do with any of the non revenue generating athletes and sports, besides how it affects them. The settlement agreement added roster limits to somehow throttle the super schools' football teams as a sort of compromise to uncorking scholie limits. I think a lot of ADs will love this because the roster limits will be a nice ceiling on expenses for all the sports that were costing them $ and not paying anything back. I personally think this is a fragile position for the NCAA and an effort to retain/regulate football and men's basketball. in the not so long term, it is a bad deal for every other sport and will not be good for 95% of all other NCAA teams in all other sports. There will probably be a few women's teams that make out well due to PC appearances to balance $ (like how women's VB and BB coaches get paid better that the market might warrant because of optics with football and men's BB coach salaries) but I foresee a lot of budget cuts to men's volleyball and possibly some women's programs as well. I am worried about scholarships but I don't think it would be the end of NCAA MVB, I am most worried about the funding of programs. I think only a few men's volleyball players would quit if they didn't get scholarships and the junior's level will not be impacted that much (women's is a different story) as long as the MVB programs are intact and there are some benefits (preferred admissions/access to 'alternate' scholarships, funds for; travel, coaches, equipment, etc., tutoring, priority class registration, etc.) I don't see how this ends up a step forward for MVB and other Olympic sports, it seems to be an inevitable step back because the market is speaking and society isn't putting the value there. So many of the athletes playing men's volleyball in the NCAA are paying most of their college expenses now, I would guess 20% at the most is the discount men's volleyball athletes are getting of the gross cost for the entire group of DI/II compared to what the entire group would pay if they attended university as a non athlete. My sky is falling take is that the overall NCAA model seems to be unraveling and I am not sure how they maintain regulations that keep a competitive field beyond more than a few universities. Maybe a lot of schools go DIII or the equivalent? |
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Post by volleycoach2310 on Aug 10, 2024 4:28:06 GMT -5
then why did they push for such excissive #s of schollies. Like really volleybal needs 18 and 12 or 14 would not have sufficed? just across the board the nubmers are frankly flabbergasting, and it may be to allow what is the football pigs to get more and more. maybe that saying will come true. pigs get fed, hogs get slaughtered. one can only hope that is the outcome for these P4s in the end. F 'em decouple the scholarship limit with the roster limit and it will make more sense. They are trying to solve a puzzle that has to do with laws the recent lawsuits have identified preventing the NCAA from making a ton of money and not paying the revenue generating athletes. Removing scholarship limits somehow fixes something and has nothing to do with any of the non revenue generating athletes and sports, besides how it affects them. The settlement agreement added roster limits to somehow throttle the super schools' football teams as a sort of compromise to uncorking scholie limits. I think a lot of ADs will love this because the roster limits will be a nice ceiling on expenses for all the sports that were costing them $ and not paying anything back. I personally think this is a fragile position for the NCAA and an effort to retain/regulate football and men's basketball. in the not so long term, it is a bad deal for every other sport and will not be good for 95% of all other NCAA teams in all other sports. There will probably be a few women's teams that make out well due to PC appearances to balance $ (like how women's VB and BB coaches get paid better that the market might warrant because of optics with football and men's BB coach salaries) but I foresee a lot of budget cuts to men's volleyball and possibly some women's programs as well. I am worried about scholarships but I don't think it would be the end of NCAA MVB, I am most worried about the funding of programs. I think only a few men's volleyball players would quit if they didn't get scholarships and the junior's level will not be impacted that much (women's is a different story) as long as the MVB programs are intact and there are some benefits (preferred admissions/access to 'alternate' scholarships, funds for; travel, coaches, equipment, etc., tutoring, priority class registration, etc.) I don't see how this ends up a step forward for MVB and other Olympic sports, it seems to be an inevitable step back because the market is speaking and society isn't putting the value there. So many of the athletes playing men's volleyball in the NCAA are paying most of their college expenses now, I would guess 20% at the most is the discount men's volleyball athletes are getting of the gross cost for the entire group of DI/II compared to what the entire group would pay if they attended university as a non athlete. My sky is falling take is that the overall NCAA model seems to be unraveling and I am not sure how they maintain regulations that keep a competitive field beyond more than a few universities. Maybe a lot of schools go DIII or the equivalent? As far as AD loving it due to roster limits for non revenue sports….I don’t think they will like that they have to give 18 scholarships now instead of 4.5. With a roster of 24 they only had to give 4.5 if they were fully funded. The big question is will they have to give 18 or can they roster 18 and give 7? The other big issue is I disagree that guys will just keep playing even if the money is gone. Maybe the guys who are in upper HS or college already…but guys who are younger may choose another sport that can offer them money. This could cripple our Olympic teams in about 10 years. Hoping for the best but definitely concerned. I know kids who are definitely getting more than 20% but I am sure there are plenty of walk ons too that may balance out your 20% number. |
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Post by babybacksets on Aug 10, 2024 6:51:14 GMT -5
So who can be sued eventually if the gluttony of football really does start to warp the landscape of college sports?
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