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Post by SportyBucky on May 31, 2019 13:37:36 GMT -5
Really? Is this necessary?? Ah, wasn't it just a couple days ago that SportyBucky called me the dramatic one for calling this out? OH, and also said that he doesn't rag on them? Looks like it was.... I've redrafted this multiple times to be crystal clear. Glad you support your former players, but they're not NT good. Sorry. I've actually not ragged on them constantly, but bless your heart for saying so. Glad you're paying really close attention to this lesson, so continue to listen up. To play OH internally, you have to pass. Wilhite, as of now, cannot. To play MB you have to be a superior blocker, or be a good blocker and be unstoppable offensively. Tapp is not either.
As balance, I have commented positively on Thompson, Rettke, Poulter, Ogbagu, & Washington. I have also said Kingdon is not the second coming of Logan Tom. I'm not just picking on the pretty, ineffective girls who have Karch's heart.
LOL. Anyway I hope therapy is going well, and I'm sorry for whatever a gopher ever did to you to cause such trauma in your life. Yikes. Sorry to have hit what appears to be a sizeable sore spot. For your sake, I won't begin on the M-I-N-N-E-S-O-T-A cheer or your awful high school gym. Now, shantay away!
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Post by Deleted on May 31, 2019 13:45:24 GMT -5
Ah, wasn't it just a couple days ago that SportyBucky called me the dramatic one for calling this out? OH, and also said that he doesn't rag on them? Looks like it was....
LOL. Anyway I hope therapy is going well, and I'm sorry for whatever a gopher ever did to you to cause such trauma in your life. Yikes. Sorry to have hit what appears to be a sizeable sore spot. For your sake, I won't begin on the M-I-N-N-E-S-O-T-A cheer or your awful high school gym. Now, shantay away! Oh god, the rouser and the Pav. Two of my least favorite things in the world. I think we actually have more in common than we realize.
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Post by Deleted on May 31, 2019 13:58:11 GMT -5
Kadie struggled to receive in Japan and she was not the terminator like Japanese teams need the foreigners to be. Why do you continue to spread lies about American players? Kadie was a primary passer for Toray and hit .330. Same season, Brankica Mikhaylovich was not a primary passer for JT Marvelous and hit .348. Neriman Ozsoy was not a primary passer for Toyota, and hit .352. Considering she had passing responsibilities and the other two didn't, her numbers were good. Honey....The job of a OH is to pass and score. If she can only score she should play OPP.
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Post by Hawk Attack on May 31, 2019 14:02:14 GMT -5
Honey....The job of a OH is to pass and score. If she can only score she should play OPP. It’s kind of rude to call a stranger “honey”.
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Post by donut on May 31, 2019 14:04:52 GMT -5
Also very strange considering he's like 14-years-old.^
@tangotango - You literally said she wasn't enough of a terminator. The stats say otherwise. Please leave the arguing to the grown-ups.
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Post by Deleted on May 31, 2019 14:08:29 GMT -5
If Lee goes to Japan she will end up like Kadie.
Japanese players must play in system, so when the pass is not perfect every ball goes to the foreigner on the team. If Lee does not pass well, she will still be the only player that can hit out of system. But that won`t work as teams will be targeting her every time.
So, she will be taken out when she`s on the back, have someone covering for her or she will play OPP.
I was not even saying Kadie`s reception was bad, but it was bad compared to the Japanese Players. Like Lee`s reception is very poor you if compare her to Japanese players ...but it is really not that bad in Europe as Europeans are not known for receiving well anyways.
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Post by Deleted on May 31, 2019 14:11:18 GMT -5
now I get it...The "doughnut" is a Nebraska fan. LOL
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Post by bvhcumoot on May 31, 2019 15:36:59 GMT -5
The thing is, we've never seen Kadie get enough of a shot on the NT to know whether or not she's "NT quality." She definitely had the right skillsets to make an impact on the left-side coming out of college. She played in Japan, which has often "killed" OHs chances at the NT. It's so strange to me because we're apparently ok with players taking a year off (Murphy, Lowe) or riding the bench/playing poorly for their pro teams (Kingdon, Gibby) but if you go to certain Asian countries to make a living, get out of here. This idea that going to Japan kills your National Team chances is ridiculous. Logan Tom, Tayeeba Haneef, and many other international players have played in Japan and significantly improved their skills, in particular, their passing and defense. This was particularly true in the prime of the V league in the 80's, 90's and mid-way through the 2000's. Because of the strict foreigner limits, there was usually only one foreign "star" per team, and the general homogeneity sometimes made the adjustment more difficult for many of them. The advantage of the Japanese league was the constant reps that were a hallmark of the Japanese volleyball tradition, with teams engaging in rigorous two a day practices regularly on top of match days. The draw-back for some players was the insistence or persistence of a cookie-cutter or one-size-fits all approach that de-emphasized a particular's player's strengths or attributes (for example, in defensive positioning). It is true that in the past few years, the overall quality of the V league has decreased. This is in part due to a decrease in the financial stability and commitment in the league, as well as some philosophical re-orientation in the Japanese Federation and the League with regards to training and team management. There also seems to be a serious dearth of any height too, for some reason. but the premise that playing in Japan, particularly for a limited time-frame, kills your career has no basis. The issue is how players incorporate that training opportunity. The bottom line is that there are few, if any, better places than Japan to go if you want to learn how to pass and improve your defense. As far as Rolfzen, I'm not sure she had the right skill sets to ever make an impact, particularly if you count attitude as a skillset. She also had some technical issues with her armswing--a tendency to hit over the top of her head with elbow bent (and something the Foecke also sometimes does), which reduced her attack effectiveness. This is a fascinating discussion. Still trying to identify the NT prospects lost to Japanese league play. Can’t lump the Asian leagues together. Same question applies To Chinese League, Thailand, etc. Passing is the chief complaint when watching US players at the next level. The games are exciting to watch! The “fans” have their favorites to be sure. But these players cannot be as bad as VT would suggest. Maybe All-American selections are political and not warranted. Or as someone commented two solid seasons of passing, as with the Rolfzen or Anae, Lee, Wilhite, etc do not translate even after a couple pro seasons.
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Post by bvhcumoot on May 31, 2019 15:38:30 GMT -5
Should take this convo to Americans in overseas... thread. Sorry.
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Post by volleyguy on May 31, 2019 16:03:59 GMT -5
The other issue is the differences in training of passing techniques. The current USA style, which has trickled down to the NCAA, relies much more on upper-body strength to manage the platform as opposed to the traditional technique still in play in Japan and other places. Adjusting between these styles, both passing and general offense, is a consideration in determining and understanding how USA players develop. Transitioning between styles is obviously a difficult thing for many players to manage. Can you expand on this? I'm fascinated. Tried to find some visuals for you. This is a short one, but watch the position of the body relative to the ground, using their legs to maintain balance and how the passing angle is created: This is a fairly good over-view of the traditional passing technique (with an easter egg sorta. I also recommend starting at 3:00): The current technique, which is GMS and men's volleyball inspired, has a higher stance and the player's arm can extend their arms/platform almost perpendicularly to create the angles (this description is a great simplification, but it's all it deserves). And so here's the current version (and the term is cushioning, not absorption.) and finally, get a load of this horridness:
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Post by vollem on May 31, 2019 16:53:22 GMT -5
Oy gevalt. The gopher and badger fandom is quickly turning into the shadow of the cardinal v husker war. I thought everyone was over it. To me, these are all young women in the early stages of their athletic careers that will go on for who knows how long. There's a reason why 6 is important. The philosophies of passing techniques are more stimulating (in the dry, academic way) imo.
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Post by ironhammer on May 31, 2019 17:55:27 GMT -5
Yes, China, as far as average height goes, wins the battle of the talls. Zhu is what, 6'5"? Did not know that about Dixon, but good for her and Beijing. And yes, Asia is large (I am, after all, of Asian descent ). Thailand's volleyball scene is growing (albeit starting with *that* match back in 2016). Same goes for the Philippines, though their height is much smaller than Thailand/Japan/Korea. Lohman, Schoenlein, Mau, and YBG are helping cultivate a bigger volleyball culture over there, though it will take at least a decade for it to make that international leap. I've veered way off the VNL topic. If Lee goes to Japan, I think she'll get the passing reps all the VTers are saying she could use. Based on all the OH performances (not counting Foecke since she's gotten married and has other things to deal with at the time being), learning from the defense playbook could benefit them all. Kelsey can't keep switching roles, JWO kinda fell off the radar (I think?), and Lake/Hentz/White are still students. Unrelated question: where did some projected NT members go? Vansant left after a short stint, and wasn't Knop supposed to be in the mix for L? There isn't much of a baton-pass for the L jersey, unlike M1/2. Yeah, there have been discussions about whether Thailand was thrown under the bus in the 2016 Olympic qualification. But I have always admired Thailand's positive energy and never-give-up court mentality. I don't have a list with me of where every prospective NT player is going. But I am sure we can dig out the info. At the end of the day, where a player decides to go isn't entirely up to her in all cases, especially for relatively new players fresh from college. There are a lot of variables involved. I am sure most players who decided to pursue a pro volleyball career aspire to play for top clubs like Vakifbank or Novara. But whether they can get the chance is another question. Sometimes, it's not an issue of simply choosing Asia vs Europe vs South/Latin America, it is whether there is an opening available. Players don't always get the luxury to choose which league they want to go to. They simply have to seize the opportunities that come their way.
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Post by wonderwarthog79 on May 31, 2019 20:50:42 GMT -5
The other issue is the differences in training of passing techniques. The current USA style, which has trickled down to the NCAA, relies much more on upper-body strength to manage the platform as opposed to the traditional technique still in play in Japan and other places. Adjusting between these styles, both passing and general offense, is a consideration in determining and understanding how USA players develop. Transitioning between styles is obviously a difficult thing for many players to manage. Can you expand on this? I'm fascinated. So what's the "traditional technique?" Are you talking about moving your figgin' feet?
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Post by wonderwarthog79 on May 31, 2019 20:54:58 GMT -5
OK, I hadn't looked at the videos before this comment, but the videos show practically nothing about passing technique. It ain't rocket surgery.
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Post by cecang on Jun 2, 2019 5:00:32 GMT -5
Is there a link for the replay ?
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