Let the poor women die you Right wing freeks

[Gorf]

What I find interesting and would like to hear an answer from the right wingers on:


1. They appear to be pro-death-penalty but still proclaim themselves as being pro-life in situations like the Schiavo case. If, as SoBB tries to claim there is POTENTIAL in the FUTURE for her to recovere then there is POTENTIAL in the FUTURE for a form of rehabilitation to be discovered for those that are currently given death sentences. The trials and overall costs of going for a death penalty sentence are commonly 2-3 (or more) times as expenses as going for a sentence of life imprisonment without options for parole.


2. They claim to be against "public handouts" like the "liberal" welfare system yet they have no problem with the many millions of dollars being donated to people like the Schindlers on free legal assistance and medical assistance that will be deducted from taxes by the law firms donating their "free" time and services and the people donating money. The amounts saved on taxes essentially comes from tax payer money and amounts to significantly more than what could / would have been received via welfare or other "public handouts".

How about the expense for special congressional sessions and flying the president from Texas to DC to sign their special bill for the Schiavo case?

More "handouts" from the right wingers that claim to hate "public handouts".


3. Why the president has seemingly been directly involved in the Schiavo case and made publics statements about the case yet hasn't said a word about the killings in Red Wing (Minnesota). The second worst such case in the history of our country behind Columbine.

Has he been quiet because those killed weren't from rich white right wing Christian families?

Has he been quiet because anything he says could be construed as speaking out in favor of gun control and might upset their right wing NRA anti-gun-control lobbyists?

If Terry Shiavo had been shot in the head and had her cerebral cortex destroyed in that manner would the president, Delay and the other right wing congressional "leaders" be spending as much time pandering to the case?

If there is some valid reason for the president not saying anything about the killings in Red Wing other than pure political motivation why doesn't he or his mouth piece McLellan give an explanation?

[Deleted]

[quote author=Gorflink=board=news&thread=1111177363&start=60#4 date=1111852746]What I find interesting and would like to hear an answer from the right wingers on:

1. They appear to be pro-death-penalty but still proclaim themselves as being pro-life in situations like the Schiavo case. [/quote]

I've wondered about this, too. Are there people out there who are BOTH anti-abortion and against the Death Penalty? There must be. But you sure don't hear from them much.

The tricky part for them is that they are making a judgment about who DESERVES to die. That's a slippery slope if ever there was one.

If, as SoBB tries to claim there is POTENTIAL in the FUTURE for her to recovere then there is POTENTIAL in the FUTURE for a form of rehabilitation to be discovered for those that are currently given death sentences.

Like the woman in Texas a few years back who was supposedly born-again, etc. etc. and W still had her executed.

The trials and overall costs of going for a death penalty sentence are commonly 2-3 (or more) times as expenses as going for a sentence of life imprisonment without options for parole.

They could, unfortunately, get those costs under control with a few law changes. The Fast Track to the Chair.

I dunno. Personally, I don't know what I believe anymore. Hard for me to not be FOR the Death Penalty in certain cases--such as killing 9-year-olds. Hard for me not to be against it when you see how unevenly it is applied.

2. They claim to be against "public handouts" like the "liberal" welfare system yet they have no problem with the many millions of dollars being donated to people like the Schindlers on free legal assistance and medical assistance that will be deducted from taxes by the law firms donating their "free" time and services and the people donating money. The amounts saved on taxes essentially comes from tax payer money and amounts to significantly more than what could / would have been received via welfare or other "public handouts".

How about the expense for special congressional sessions and flying the president from Texas to DC to sign their special bill for the Schiavo case?

More "handouts" from the right wingers that claim to hate "public handouts".

If their cause is "just", they have no problem spending the money. Unfortunately, these pseudo-Christians wouldn't know a just case if it bit them in the behind.

3. Why the president has seemingly been directly involved in the Schiavo case and made publics statements about the case yet hasn't said a word about the killings in Red Wing (Minnesota). The second worst such case in the history of our country behind Columbine.

Has he been quiet because those killed weren't from rich white right wing Christian families?

Has he been quiet because anything he says could be construed as speaking out in favor of gun control and might upset their right wing NRA anti-gun-control lobbyists?

If Terry Shiavo had been shot in the head and had her cerebral cortex destroyed in that manner would the president, Delay and the other right wing congressional "leaders" be spending as much time pandering to the case?

If there is some valid reason for the president not saying anything about the killings in Red Wing other than pure political motivation why doesn't he or his mouth piece McLellan give an explanation?

That's the part of all this I really don't get. Why aren't these people involved in gun control if they are so concerned about the loss of innocent life? I have never understood why the Right Wing is pro-gun.

As for the Red Lake killings, I do think it is human nature to try to distance yourself from horrible things like this. Unfortunately, the fact this happened on an Indian Reservation makes that natural reaction border on racist.

[Barefoot In Kailua]

HoldThePickle said:

Gorf,

Right wing freaks like BiK & SOB dont' care about facts.
They get caught up in the emotions & distortions of their Right to life friends.

First of all I'm no right -winger, I'm independent. Second of all as I told you before, I'm not a "right to life" advocate, I am pro-choice but I do think starving a woman to death against the wishes of her family is a really heinous and despicable thing to do.

[Barefoot In Kailua]

[quote author=Gorflink=board=news&thread=1111177363&start=60#4 date=1111852746]What I find interesting and would like to hear an answer from the right wingers on:


1. They appear to be pro-death-penalty but still proclaim themselves as being pro-life in situations like the Schiavo case. If, as SoBB tries to claim there is POTENTIAL in the FUTURE for her to recovere then there is POTENTIAL in the FUTURE for a form of rehabilitation to be discovered for those that are currently given death sentences. The trials and overall costs of going for a death penalty sentence are commonly 2-3 (or more) times as expenses as going for a sentence of life imprisonment without options for parole.


[/quote]

Are you not familiar with Hammurabi's concept of Lex Talionis? Murderers should be put to death. Rehabilitation should not the goal of the courts, equal PUNISHMENT should be the goal. Terry Schiavo commited no crime, why should she and her family be punished further?

[sonofbarcelonabob]

(R)uffda! said:

I've wondered about this, too. Are there people out there who are BOTH anti-abortion and against the Death Penalty? There must be. But you sure don't hear from them much.

Yes there are, and yes you don't hear from us much (about Pro-Life and against the Death Penalty).

[sonofbarcelonabob]

Having read a follow-up story on the Red Lake shootings, it appeared that the tribal officials themselves asked for privacy from the media.

Tribal officials also allowed medical examiners to perform autopsies on the victims even though they had to waive their custom of burying their dead within 2 days, to allow the autopsies to be performed.

[Deleted]

Gorf is steering you all wrong--it's Red Lake.

Red Wing is somewhere else (hour or so south of the Twin Cities).

[sonofbarcelonabob]

Woops...maybe he had the NHL on his mind.

[Deleted]

SonofBarcelonaBob said:

Yes there are, and yes you don't hear from us much (about Pro-Life and against the Death Penalty).

And then there are those of us who are wishy-washy about both. Anti-abortion and anti-death penalty in theory, but waffling in practice.

I--as a man (such as I am)--just have a difficult time believing I should tell women what to do with their bodies.

And, as I said before, I also have a tough time seeing what possible value someone who kills (after molesting) 9-year-old girls brings to the world. As I grow older, I find myself with less and less tolerance for the scum of the earth...

But I still don't feel like I have a right to decide who is scum and who is not.

(Tom DeLay (and the wacko Christian Right) gets on my nerves for precisely this reason. He believes he DOES get to decide these things.)

I would hate to be the judges, a parent, or a spouse in this Schiavo mess. Whatever else I may have said or believe, it's an awful case and an awful fate for all.

[bigfan]

(R)uffda! said:

I would hate to be the judges, a parent, or a spouse in this Schiavo mess. Whatever else I may have said or believe, it's an awful case and an awful fate for all.

It is terribly sad.

[The Bofa on the Sofa]

SonofBarcelonaBob said:

Not only are you a dumbazz, you are also an ignorant dumbazz.

Every diagnosis made on Terry Schiavo has been made by a doctor appointed by her husband. She has not received any meaningful treatment since 1991.

This is an excerpt from the site - www.terrisfight.org

MYTH: Terri is PVS (Persistent vegetative state)

You know the really funny thing? For the first 10 years or so, the question of whether Schiavo was in a PVS was NOT IN DISPUTE.

I need to find the report of the court-appointed-guardian, but he notes that both the husband and the parents had acknowledged that she was in a PVS.

In fact, the parents were perfectly fine with that diagnosis right up until it was unequivocally established that the husband was the legal guardian and was the only one with the authority to decide on her behalf whether the feeding tube should be in or out (and it wasn't a controversial ruling legally - this is what the law says should happen).

All of a suddent, the parents started claiming that she wasn't in a PVS, and bringing on their "right-to-life" doctors to testify. In the end, it is clear that they were making any argument they could, even if it contradicted their earlier claims (along with their propaganda campaign to discredit the husband).

Amazingly, even after all this happened, this website is _still_ full of sh!t, because the courts later rulings were based on the opinion of a court-appointed doctor, in addition to doctors provided by both sides.

The problem was, the doctors the parents provided had no basis for their claims against PVS. It is kind of like the pro-life doctor who came out this week as "new evidence" against the PVS. If you read his report, he ended up saying basically, "He saw no evidence of any brain activity or any response, but he still thinks the diagnosis is wrong."

His conclusions did not follow at all from his observations. He described the patient as having all the signs of a PVS, but then claims that his gut feeling is that it is not. Jeb Bush might not be able to see through his BS, but the court sure did.

The other doctors provided by the parents were no better. None has ever presented an objective case that she is not in a PVS, whereas the PVS diagnosis is overwhelmingly clinically supported.

But your source won't tell you all this.

[sonofbarcelonabob]

Agent said:

You know the really funny thing?

There is absolutely nothing funny about the entire situation. Poor choice of words.

A woman is dying, and you're arguing the merits of a web site. Nice.

Idiot.

[Barefoot In Kailua]

All kidding , name calling, and banter aside, I agree with SOBB's remarks above. There is nothing funny about what is happening with the Terry Schiavo situation.

[The Bofa on the Sofa]

SonofBarcelonaBob said:

There is absolutely nothing funny about the entire situation. Poor choice of words.

A woman is dying, and you're arguing the merits of a web site. Nice.

Idiot.

So because a woman is dying (which is what is her choice, the courts have determined), it means that it is ok to use whatever means you want to change it, including lying? In fact, it is BECAUSE she is dying that we have to seriously consider the _facts_, and not cheapen the discussion with made up nonsense.

But you clearly don't care about that. The truth doesn't matter to you. It doesn't matter that she is in a PVS. It doesn't matter to you that her spouse went above and beyond the call to try to save her. It doesn't matter that the law requires the spouse to make decisions on her behalf. It doesn't matter that it has been established countless times in court that it is clear she would not have wanted to live like this. It doesn't matter that thousands of families all over the country make this same heartwrenching decision every year. None of that matters to you. All you care is that they have to keep a woman in a permanent vegetative state alive artificially and against her will.

[sonofbarcelonabob]

Agent said:

So because a woman is dying (which is what is her choice, the courts have determined), it means that it is ok to use whatever means you want to change it, including lying? In fact, it is BECAUSE she is dying that we have to seriously consider the _facts_, and not cheapen the discussion with made up nonsense.

But you clearly don't care about that. The truth doesn't matter to you. It doesn't matter that she is in a PVS. It doesn't matter to you that her spouse went above and beyond the call to try to save her. It doesn't matter that the law requires the spouse to make decisions on her behalf. It doesn't matter that it has been established countless times in court that it is clear she would not have wanted to live like this. It doesn't matter that thousands of families all over the country make this same heartwrenching decision every year. None of that matters to you. All you care is that they have to keep a woman in a permanent vegetative state alive artificially and against her will.

Don't presume to know what I care about, you turd.

We're still waiting for you to explain why you find all of this funny.