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Post by TexVB on Aug 12, 2012 13:35:38 GMT -5
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Post by Edmond on Aug 12, 2012 23:13:58 GMT -5
Stop fooling yourselves. The USA team is NOT superior than Brazil. Let's consider all positions. OHs are pretty evenly matched; middles are about the same in blocking with Brazil's slightly better in attacking; setters again pretty much even in setting (both are not perfect); Sheilla vs Hooker, Hooker wins in height and power while Sheila wins in speed, ball control and defense. Mentally, the USA is weak, so weak. Before I stop "fooling myself", could you please provide us with the number of times Brazil has beaten USA in the last four years? I just want to make sure I'm going on facts instead of personal bias like some people tend to do. Number of times means nothing. Do you know that China had beaten Cuba 13 straight times going into Barcelona in 92? Brazil won the two most important matches against the USA in this quad - 2010 World Champ second round and the Olympics final. It doesn't matter how many times the USA have beaten Brazil in the last year or two. They were not playing at their best due to various reasons such as injuries. I cannot believe how full of themselves some of the posters here are, still calling this an upset.
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Post by OverAndUnder on Aug 13, 2012 0:02:46 GMT -5
Before I stop "fooling myself", could you please provide us with the number of times Brazil has beaten USA in the last four years? I just want to make sure I'm going on facts instead of personal bias like some people tend to do. So? Do you know that China beat Cuba 13 times before Barcelona but they ended up 7th? It doesn't matter how many times you beat Brazil in the last year. They were not at their best due to various reasons. The number one world ranking doesn't mean much either in this sport. Volleyball isn't tennis. I cannot believe how full of themselves some of the posters here are, still calling this an upset. "So?" Really? Are you familiar with the concept of "hand waving"? Because that's what you're doing here. So you're saying direct head-to-head results don't matter in evaluating two teams. Okay. Why do I suspect you're going to turn around and make an exception to say that head-to-head results suddenly do matter if the match is the one that occured on August 11, 2012 between USA and Brazil? So you're saying the previous half-dozen times these two teams met and USA won, Brazil was never at their best "due to various reasons". Okay. Why do I suspect you can come up with a long list of excuses for Brazil's multiple losses over the last several years, but you won't consider any reasons for why USA lost this one match in 2012? Wave. Wave. Wave. Wave. Wave. Wave. Full of themselves? Who are "themselves"? To my knowledge none of the 12 roster players or the numerous staff were on VolleyTalk Saturday during or after the match posting comments calling it an upset. If a PSU fan were to say their school had the best women's volleyball team in the NCAA from 2007-2009, it would be illogical to say that statement means they're "full of themselves". USA has had a far superior record to Brazil over the last two years - that is, if you judge volleyball teams by actual results of volleyball games on a volleyball court - but Brazil had a far superior performance in this particular match. That is precisely the very definition of an "upset".
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Post by Edmond on Aug 13, 2012 0:38:28 GMT -5
It's NOT an upset when both teams are pretty much equal physically and skill-wise going into the match.
Far superior record my ass! Brazil won the two most important matches against the USA in this quad - 2010 World Champ second round and this Olympics final, and that is all it counts. The biggest win for the US against Brazil was during last year's World Cup, but Brazil didn't bring their best squad because of injuries, and there were not at their best form. Just because the US holds a better head-to-head record against Brazil (over the last two years) doesn't necessarily mean it's superior.
Who are "themselves"? Of course I meant people like you and some others I have seen posting in this thread. The fact that you still think the US is superior after the final proves my point. I am not talking about the staff and players. That said, the number one cause of mental meltdown is going into the match with a mindset of thinking you're far superior than your opponents.
Stop making false assumptions.
USA lost because they underestimated Brazil's ability to fight back after their easy first set win, which gave the Brazilians the opportunity to attack them in a way they were not prepared to defend themselves, causing the dreaded mental breakdown. If both teams had played well, the match could go either way.
No, I am not familiar with the concept of "hand waving", and I don't give a flying !!!!###$$$!!! what it means. So thank you for nothing.
I only pay attention to international volleyball, sorry. But I'm hoping you're NOT trying to imply that the USA is THE best team in the world from 2011-2012.
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Post by kolohekeiki on Aug 13, 2012 0:53:45 GMT -5
Berg is not good. I watched this match with some college players who asked me why our setter was fat and out of shape! That was their first impression! She made so many serving, location, and defensive errors, I couldn't defend her. Even her demeanor was poor when her hitters needed it most. I honestly wouldn't have her set a NCAA top 15 team. Well if you wouldn't have her set for an NCAA top 15 team...she already got you beat as she set on TWO OLYMPIC SILVER medal teams...how much US setters can say that! I hope you feel real good about yourself having to degrade an amazing athlete and role model to many young players out there! you should be ashamed of the comments you have made in this thread and others for that matter...are you that pathetic that you need to post the same things in multiple threads just to get noticed and attention? I hope you know your post shows more of what kind of person you are than what it does for Berg!
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bruno
Junior High
Posts: 1
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Post by bruno on Aug 13, 2012 8:50:11 GMT -5
I am brazilian and I do think USA has a far superior team than Brazil. Actually, pretty much everyone in Brazil thinks so. All sports critics agreed that it would take 2 things for Brazil to win: 1) Brazil needed to play their mast match in 2011-2012; 2) USA needed to play an average match. And that is what happened. Brazil had lots of losses in the last 8 years due to mental weakness. This was the first time I saw this happening to the USA. If both teams played well, I have no doubt USA would have won the match. Anyway, I hope we meet again in the finals in Rio!
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Post by vbman09 on Aug 13, 2012 8:52:20 GMT -5
I want to start by saying I don't post much on this board so don't take my statement as a reflection of I told you so, but as a former set and former college coach i thought Berg was OK. Not great and not horrible, she backed up in 2008 and became the starter because no one else stepped up in the past 4 years. Glass according to Barnett from the Net Live said she didn't play well.
CT was IMOP better then Berg, she established the Middle more, and had a better tempo on the Outside. However Hugh liked Berg more the CT and since he runs the team and has tons more experience then anyone in here I will not question him. I just hope going forward that Glass or maybe a Carli Lloyd can step up. Once again I am not saying Berg is the reason we lost, I am saying that I wasn't a fan of her, and those that made fun of her shape no nothing, she doesnt have to be ripped to be a good setter.
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Post by Reach on Aug 13, 2012 9:29:07 GMT -5
The U.S. had beaten Brazil 6 times in a row going into yesterday's match. LMAO. Reach.....living up to your avatar! The USA team was the #1 team going into this tourney and for a reason. An excellent group of seasoned Brazilian women seized and opportunity and let it fly. Our girls and coaches never recovered ........it happens. BRAVO AND HUGE CONGRATS TO BRAZIL.....2012 OLYMPIC GOLD. For the record im glad i was wrong on the seriousness and severity of whatever Berg's injury was. Before you call someone out, make sure you understand how to use the quote function correctly.
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Post by Reach on Aug 13, 2012 9:34:59 GMT -5
Before I stop "fooling myself", could you please provide us with the number of times Brazil has beaten USA in the last four years? I just want to make sure I'm going on facts instead of personal bias like some people tend to do. Number of times means nothing. Do you know that China had beaten Cuba 13 straight times going into Barcelona in 92? Brazil won the two most important matches against the USA in this quad - 2010 World Champ second round and the Olympics final. It doesn't matter how many times the USA have beaten Brazil in the last year or two. They were not playing at their best due to various reasons such as injuries. I cannot believe how full of themselves some of the posters here are, still calling this an upset. You are insane. Brazil was almost out of this tournament losing to teams that USA sweeped or lost one set to. Brazil has been losing to the USA B team this year. If that doesn't illustrate the level at which both national teams have been, I don't know what will. Brazil, played their best ball. Dani Lins had the best match of her life, while team USA had the worst match, at the wrong time. Plain and simple. Brazil earned it. USA choked. End of story. Congrats on a 2nd Silver medal, team USA! We are with you.
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Post by itsallrelative on Aug 13, 2012 11:07:19 GMT -5
I want to start by saying I don't post much on this board so don't take my statement as a reflection of I told you so, but as a former set and former college coach i thought Berg was OK. Not great and not horrible, she backed up in 2008 and became the starter because no one else stepped up in the past 4 years. Glass according to Barnett from the Net Live said she didn't play well. CT was IMOP better then Berg, she established the Middle more, and had a better tempo on the Outside. However Hugh liked Berg more the CT and since he runs the team and has tons more experience then anyone in here I will not question him. I just hope going forward that Glass or maybe a Carli Lloyd can step up. Once again I am not saying Berg is the reason we lost, I am saying that I wasn't a fan of her, and those that made fun of her shape no nothing, she doesnt have to be ripped to be a good setter. I was disappointed that we were playing poorly enough that we couldn't use the double sub (which takes 4 subs) because we had to sub for an OH and MH. Think of how much things change--4 years ago, we were all elated that we got the silver, now, the same brings disappointment.
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Post by mikegarrison on Aug 13, 2012 13:04:04 GMT -5
I am brazilian and I do think USA has a far superior team than Brazil. Actually, pretty much everyone in Brazil thinks so. All sports critics agreed that it would take 2 things for Brazil to win: 1) Brazil needed to play their mast match in 2011-2012; 2) USA needed to play an average match. And that is what happened. Brazil had lots of losses in the last 8 years due to mental weakness. This was the first time I saw this happening to the USA. If both teams played well, I have no doubt USA would have won the match. Anyway, I hope we meet again in the finals in Rio! That's sports for you. If the outcome was always predictable, nobody would watch it.
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Post by jagdpanther on Aug 13, 2012 14:23:04 GMT -5
I am brazilian and I do think USA has a far superior team than Brazil. Actually, pretty much everyone in Brazil thinks so. All sports critics agreed that it would take 2 things for Brazil to win: 1) Brazil needed to play their mast match in 2011-2012; 2) USA needed to play an average match. And that is what happened. Brazil had lots of losses in the last 8 years due to mental weakness. This was the first time I saw this happening to the USA. If both teams played well, I have no doubt USA would have won the match. Anyway, I hope we meet again in the finals in Rio! *sigh* Of all times for that to happen, too... Yes, it's four years away and lots can happen by then, but the 2016 games are in Brazil. What are the real chances that the Brazilians would not just blast their way through to gold on their home turf?
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Post by Murina on Aug 13, 2012 15:53:07 GMT -5
Yes, it's four years away and lots can happen by then, but the 2016 games are in Brazil. What are the real chances that the Brazilians would not just blast their way through to gold on their home turf? You mean like China did in Beijing? ;D
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Post by Reach on Aug 13, 2012 16:12:00 GMT -5
Yes, it's four years away and lots can happen by then, but the 2016 games are in Brazil. What are the real chances that the Brazilians would not just blast their way through to gold on their home turf? You mean like China did in Beijing? ;D True, but China lost a lot of what made them great in 2004 by the time Beijing came around.
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Post by Edmond on Aug 13, 2012 23:52:52 GMT -5
Number of times means nothing. Do you know that China had beaten Cuba 13 straight times going into Barcelona in 92? Brazil won the two most important matches against the USA in this quad - 2010 World Champ second round and the Olympics final. It doesn't matter how many times the USA have beaten Brazil in the last year or two. They were not playing at their best due to various reasons such as injuries. I cannot believe how full of themselves some of the posters here are, still calling this an upset. You are insane. Brazil was almost out of this tournament losing to teams that USA sweeped or lost one set to. Brazil has been losing to the USA B team this year. If that doesn't illustrate the level at which both national teams have been, I don't know what will. Brazil, played their best ball. Dani Lins had the best match of her life, while team USA had the worst match, at the wrong time. Plain and simple. Brazil earned it. USA choked. End of story. Congrats on a 2nd Silver medal, team USA! We are with you. LAMO, I am insane? I can see more clearly than the two of you. You guys should get out off your high horses! Brazil has been having very difficult times since last year leading up to the Olympics. Yes, they played poorly in the preliminaries, but remember what Sheila said after Brazil defeated China? "If we go through, we will win the gold.", and they did. The match against Russia completely fired them up, and they finally found their best form again. The USA is one of the best teams right now but not better than Brazil at least not in the mental strength department. If the USA were indeed far superior than its opponents, they would not have choked. Think about the reasons why they choked. On the level of play in the international arena, again, don't flatter yourself. . The overall level in London is worse than Beijing. In fact, the level has been dropping in the women's game since after Athens.
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