Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2020 19:56:12 GMT -5
If I were a HS coach and a player of mine bailed on our season to play club I would have a hard time welcoming them back to my program later. Seems to me that decision would be a final one. Most coaches would make different decisions based on the individual player. If the player is 6'2" with killer skills and can touch 11'6" and lead us to a league, section, and possibly state championship, we're gonna welcome her back and give her lots of hugs. If she is average, or below, and her parents don't donate huge chunks to our fundraising, well sorry someone else beat you out for that spot. #realcoachtalk Since you brought it up and a little of the subject. Do you actually know any girl 6"2" that can touch 11"6" if so I would love to see it. The top of the antenna on a womens court is just under 10" and I have yet to see anyone touch that. The height you are suggesting is in the range of Kobe and Giannis, so I would think that girl would be something special. Post a photo or video if you have it, thanks.
|
|
|
Post by eazy on Aug 8, 2020 20:17:10 GMT -5
Most coaches would make different decisions based on the individual player. If the player is 6'2" with killer skills and can touch 11'6" and lead us to a league, section, and possibly state championship, we're gonna welcome her back and give her lots of hugs. If she is average, or below, and her parents don't donate huge chunks to our fundraising, well sorry someone else beat you out for that spot. #realcoachtalk Since you brought it up and a little of the subject. Do you actually know any girl 6"2" that can touch 11"6" if so I would love to see it. The top of the antenna on a womens court is just under 10" and I have yet to see anyone touch that. The height you are suggesting is in the range of Kobe and Giannis, so I would think that girl would be something special. Post a photo or video if you have it, thanks. For what it’s worth, plenty of women’s player touch 10”.. That’s really nothing special. 10”6’-10”8’ is special. But the idea of giving preferential treatment to better players is nothing new. The best players will get the most leeway. Coaches have discretion to decide who will help their program the most long-term. That being said, coaches holding grudges can be a very serious issue but there is little solution for that. It takes either a quality administration or repeated abuse that results in athlete response for anything to happen.
|
|
|
Post by Brutus Buckeye on Aug 8, 2020 21:15:01 GMT -5
Please refrain from abusing the HS GVB players.
TiA.
|
|
cutshot818
Junior
2020 VT All-Rookie Team
Posts: 289
|
Post by cutshot818 on Aug 8, 2020 22:55:54 GMT -5
11'6" was an exaggeration, of course. Alot of it has to do with standing reach, and the combination of an above-average vertical jump with a really good standing reach. As women's volleyballers at the NCAA and national team levels get taller, their standing reach also gets higher. Someone like Drews, Hill, Plummer, or Thompson who are all in the 6'4" to 6'6" range probably have standing reaches well in excess of 8 feet. I would guess Thompson is the most exceptional jumper out of the four I mentioned. If her standing reach is somewhere in the 8'4" to 8'6" range and her approach jump is in the lower 30's, it is very conceivable that she is touching near 11'.
On the flip side, in the men's game, 11'6" probably won't get you anything other than libero or setter for the USA Men. By comparison, Matt Anderson is touching in excess of 12'8".
|
|
|
Post by binexus on Aug 8, 2020 23:29:53 GMT -5
11'6" was an exaggeration, of course. Alot of it has to do with standing reach, and the combination of an above-average vertical jump with a really good standing reach. As women's volleyballers at the NCAA and national team levels get taller, their standing reach also gets higher. Someone like Drews, Hill, Plummer, or Thompson who are all in the 6'4" to 6'6" range probably have standing reaches well in excess of 8 feet. I would guess Thompson is the most exceptional jumper out of the four I mentioned. If her standing reach is somewhere in the 8'4" to 8'6" range and her approach jump is in the lower 30's, it is very conceivable that she is touching near 11'. On the flip side, in the men's game, 11'6" probably won't get you anything other than libero or setter for the USA Men. By comparison, Matt Anderson is touching in excess of 12'8". Not sure if an exaggeration. However, if that were the case, he'd have what is likely the highest spike touch on record. I'm sure that he jumps very high, but the highest that I could find with cursory research was that he touched 12'3" or ~374 cm years ago. There are men's players that touch higher than that; Daenen Gyimah (UCLA alum) touches around 12'6" and Sharone V-E who touches 12'6.5" are some examples, and they are both younger with potential to increase that (which is insane).
|
|
cutshot818
Junior
2020 VT All-Rookie Team
Posts: 289
|
Post by cutshot818 on Aug 9, 2020 0:01:18 GMT -5
11'6" was an exaggeration, of course. Alot of it has to do with standing reach, and the combination of an above-average vertical jump with a really good standing reach. As women's volleyballers at the NCAA and national team levels get taller, their standing reach also gets higher. Someone like Drews, Hill, Plummer, or Thompson who are all in the 6'4" to 6'6" range probably have standing reaches well in excess of 8 feet. I would guess Thompson is the most exceptional jumper out of the four I mentioned. If her standing reach is somewhere in the 8'4" to 8'6" range and her approach jump is in the lower 30's, it is very conceivable that she is touching near 11'. On the flip side, in the men's game, 11'6" probably won't get you anything other than libero or setter for the USA Men. By comparison, Matt Anderson is touching in excess of 12'8". Not sure if an exaggeration. However, if that were the case, he'd have what is likely the highest spike touch on record. I'm sure that he jumps very high, but the highest that I could find with cursory research was that he touched 12'3" or ~374 cm years ago. There are men's players that touch higher than that; Daenen Gyimah (UCLA alum) touches around 12'6" and Sharone V-E who touches 12'6.5" are some examples, and they are both younger with potential to increase that (which is insane). I have seen a video of Matt using a Vertec at ASC. They had the Vertec mounted on a plyo box. The max setting on a Vertec is 12' (I know because own one) when it's set up normally on the floor. Can't remember where I saw the video. I have a friend who was one of his coaches, I'll ask him if he remembers where that video is on the web or if he has a copy or link to it. This video was probably from when Matt was in his early 20's, so yes, he probably doesn't touch that anymore.
|
|
cutshot818
Junior
2020 VT All-Rookie Team
Posts: 289
|
Post by cutshot818 on Aug 9, 2020 0:05:28 GMT -5
11'6" was an exaggeration, of course. Alot of it has to do with standing reach, and the combination of an above-average vertical jump with a really good standing reach. As women's volleyballers at the NCAA and national team levels get taller, their standing reach also gets higher. Someone like Drews, Hill, Plummer, or Thompson who are all in the 6'4" to 6'6" range probably have standing reaches well in excess of 8 feet. I would guess Thompson is the most exceptional jumper out of the four I mentioned. If her standing reach is somewhere in the 8'4" to 8'6" range and her approach jump is in the lower 30's, it is very conceivable that she is touching near 11'. On the flip side, in the men's game, 11'6" probably won't get you anything other than libero or setter for the USA Men. By comparison, Matt Anderson is touching in excess of 12'8". Not sure if an exaggeration. However, if that were the case, he'd have what is likely the highest spike touch on record. I'm sure that he jumps very high, but the highest that I could find with cursory research was that he touched 12'3" or ~374 cm years ago. There are men's players that touch higher than that; Daenen Gyimah (UCLA alum) touches around 12'6" and Sharone V-E who touches 12'6.5" are some examples, and they are both younger with potential to increase that (which is insane). Jeff Menzel is definitely hovering over 12' in this photo. And this was off a block-jump, so his approach jump would be even higher.
|
|
|
Post by binexus on Aug 9, 2020 7:56:02 GMT -5
Not sure if an exaggeration. However, if that were the case, he'd have what is likely the highest spike touch on record. I'm sure that he jumps very high, but the highest that I could find with cursory research was that he touched 12'3" or ~374 cm years ago. There are men's players that touch higher than that; Daenen Gyimah (UCLA alum) touches around 12'6" and Sharone V-E who touches 12'6.5" are some examples, and they are both younger with potential to increase that (which is insane). Jeff Menzel is definitely hovering over 12' in this photo. And this was off a block-jump, so his approach jump would be even higher. For what it's worth, the top of the antenna in the men's game is 3.23 m tall (2.43 m net height + 80 cm of the antenna). If that were the case, and even if we were to give him a couple more cm based on not having a clear shot (a shot from the side or at the net would be better than a shot from behind the baseline), and because it's not clear if he's still rising, he'd be a little bit higher here in this shot. Still pretty ridiculous for a block jump, but nowhere near 12'. While these jumpers have wild maximum touches or beat their PBs in training and using the vertec, it is rare for a player to hit their absolute maximum jump in a game. Even though some of the players I've talked about touch over 12' feet, it's likely they are hitting at lower heights in the context of a volleyball match.
|
|
|
Post by oldnewbie on Aug 9, 2020 9:25:40 GMT -5
A few years back a high school girl was being promoted with a 42 inch jump. A couple years into college and she was listed with a 31 inch jump. That sums up my opinion of the validity of most jump touch figures. They are measured wildly differently for both intentional and accidental reasons, so are ppnot always very useful for comparison.
When I see players routinely out jump opponents in matches with jumps listed 4" to 5" higher, I question the accuracy and usefulness of pure jump touch numbers.
|
|
|
Post by c4ndlelight on Aug 9, 2020 11:13:06 GMT -5
I remember SPVB was promoting one of the Haggertys at 10-3 or 10-4 and then she got to Nebraska and "didn't play high enough to hit in the Big Ten."
|
|
|
Post by Brutus Buckeye on Aug 9, 2020 11:19:44 GMT -5
There's what, maybe five WNBA players that can dunk? If that?
Anything over ten feet would be pretty elite.
Edit: upon googling, there are only three players that have ever dunked in a game, during the WNBA's entire history.
|
|
|
Post by c4ndlelight on Aug 9, 2020 11:24:15 GMT -5
You need to touch about 10-5 to dunk, not 10-0. Also there are more players who touch high enough to dunk than can in a game because 1) many can't palm the ball, and 2) they are nervous about missing or don't want the spectacle.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2020 12:07:05 GMT -5
I remember SPVB was promoting one of the Haggertys at 10-3 or 10-4 and then she got to Nebraska and "didn't play high enough to hit in the Big Ten." What you touch and the height you are effective at are two very different things. The SPVB and Nebraska statements can both be true.
|
|
cutshot818
Junior
2020 VT All-Rookie Team
Posts: 289
|
Post by cutshot818 on Aug 9, 2020 12:34:10 GMT -5
You need to touch about 10-5 to dunk, not 10-0. Also there are more players who touch high enough to dunk than can in a game because 1) many can't palm the ball, and 2) they are nervous about missing or don't want the spectacle. Yup. Karch Kiraly was in some kind of celebrity sports contest back in the 80's where all the contestants had to try to dunk. He couldn't do it because he couldn't palm a basketball. I have a friend who played collegiate basketball. She's 5'9", maybe 5'10". When we were in our 20's she could stand under the basketball rim and jump up and grab the rim off a standing jump. Her vert was somewhere in the mid-30's, which is remarkable for a female athlete in any sport. She routinely hit right over the top of me during co-ed play. Haha.
|
|
cutshot818
Junior
2020 VT All-Rookie Team
Posts: 289
|
Post by cutshot818 on Aug 9, 2020 12:37:52 GMT -5
Jeff Menzel is definitely hovering over 12' in this photo. And this was off a block-jump, so his approach jump would be even higher. For what it's worth, the top of the antenna in the men's game is 3.23 m tall (2.43 m net height + 80 cm of the antenna). If that were the case, and even if we were to give him a couple more cm based on not having a clear shot (a shot from the side or at the net would be better than a shot from behind the baseline), and because it's not clear if he's still rising, he'd be a little bit higher here in this shot. Still pretty ridiculous for a block jump, but nowhere near 12'. While these jumpers have wild maximum touches or beat their PBs in training and using the vertec, it is rare for a player to hit their absolute maximum jump in a game. Even though some of the players I've talked about touch over 12' feet, it's likely they are hitting at lower heights in the context of a volleyball match. Jeff Menzel is 6'5". His sternum is at the top of the tape in this picture. What is the length between a 6'5" person's sternum to the tip of their fingertips with their arms fully extended? Do the math. His arms are no where near fully extended in this shot.
|
|