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Post by badgerbreath on Sept 27, 2022 21:59:44 GMT -5
I agree with the 2017 analogy. There are a lot of players left from the national championship, but frankly they are all still young, as in 2017. I remember from that year you have to get worse before you get better. Team sports are like that.
Add new setters running a new system into the mix and there is even more to learn. I remember being frustrated by Hilley’s conservatism in 2017. Ashburn and Hammill can also get conservative. It may take a while for them to build confidence, more so because each is not the only setter. But they have better weapons on the pins than Hilley did, so maybe the transition won’t take as long to bear fruit.
I generally think problems with passing on serves between seams can be solved. The years that was a real problem is when UW was trying to hide Haggerty and Loberg so they both could focus on hitting. Franklin is a better passer than either though, and used to carrying the load. I think GG can be a good passer if she knows her space and simplifies her game.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2022 21:59:49 GMT -5
Three things have stood out as concerning patterns in September: * teams are exploiting the back row gap between Franklin/GG, and poor first ball contact seems to occur most often here. I am not confident there's a quick solution here, as Jade's back row passing has also been suspect (look no further than the Florida match). Just counting the matches until Bram is eligible. * service pressure has dropped considerably since the Kentucky match. Izzy in particular has really slumped (3 aces, 13 errors) since Kentucky. * 10 matches into the season, and Izzy/MJ still don't look like they have the timing with their mids. Quick middle attacks are seldom. Feels like Izzy/MJ are more trusting of their pins and elite defenses are picking up on their honesty. It feels like 2017 all over again for Wisc. That year, the Badgers looked good early vs non-conference opponents, then lost 7 out of 9 matches to ranked B1G teams. That 2017 squad just could not close out matches (a lot of 5-set losses) and lacked the toughness/experience to ride the storm when opponents went on scoring runs. Service errors at ill-timed moments near the end of sets. Building that toughness and fortitude takes longer than a season. Like 2017, I'm going to consider an Elite 8 appearance and a .550 record a success. Hoping the tides change when October rolls around, but the conference parity is fierce this year and that road schedule to end the regular season just looks nasty. Demps played the back row in Florida game? News to me. |
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Post by badgerbreath on Sept 27, 2022 22:10:47 GMT -5
I don’t know if people remember, but in 2017 the badgers started to do better right at the end of the season. They took a set off Stanford in the sweet 16.
In 2018, it felt like they were still trying to figure out how best to get the balance between Rettke and the rest of the attack right. They were also susceptible to dominant hitters, and to getting served out of matches.
That continued until early 2019, until a switch went off during the PSU match.
In other words, it was a long haul. But there were a lotta injuries and a less attacking talent than there is now.
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Post by badgerbreath on Sept 27, 2022 22:14:22 GMT -5
Three things have stood out as concerning patterns in September: * teams are exploiting the back row gap between Franklin/GG, and poor first ball contact seems to occur most often here. I am not confident there's a quick solution here, as Jade's back row passing has also been suspect (look no further than the Florida match). Just counting the matches until Bram is eligible. * service pressure has dropped considerably since the Kentucky match. Izzy in particular has really slumped (3 aces, 13 errors) since Kentucky. * 10 matches into the season, and Izzy/MJ still don't look like they have the timing with their mids. Quick middle attacks are seldom. Feels like Izzy/MJ are more trusting of their pins and elite defenses are picking up on their honesty. It feels like 2017 all over again for Wisc. That year, the Badgers looked good early vs non-conference opponents, then lost 7 out of 9 matches to ranked B1G teams. That 2017 squad just could not close out matches (a lot of 5-set losses) and lacked the toughness/experience to ride the storm when opponents went on scoring runs. Service errors at ill-timed moments near the end of sets. Building that toughness and fortitude takes longer than a season. Like 2017, I'm going to consider an Elite 8 appearance and a .550 record a success. Hoping the tides change when October rolls around, but the conference parity is fierce this year and that road schedule to end the regular season just looks nasty. Demps played the back row in Florida game? News to me. She definitely served. That was important to the comeback in the 3rd. They couldn’t handle her looping serves for some reason. When I see that, I begin to think training everyone to serve in the same way is not the best idea. |
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Post by robtearle on Sept 27, 2022 22:16:27 GMT -5
I don’t know if people remember, but in 2017 the badgers started to do better right at the end of the season. They took a set off Stanford in the sweet 16. In 2018, it felt like they were still trying to figure out how best to get the balance between Rettke and the rest of the attack right. They were also susceptible to dominant hitters, and to getting served out of matches. That continued until early 2019, until a switch went off during the PSU match. In other words, it was a long haul. But there were a lotta injuries and a less attacking talent than there is now. The 2017 freshmen won a national championship last year. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2022 22:20:03 GMT -5
Demps played the back row in Florida game? News to me. She definitely served. That was important to the comeback in the 3rd. They couldn’t handle her looping serves for some reason. When I see that, I begin to think training everyone to serve in the same way is not the best idea. Served yes but a poor game passing? Like to see the stats. I was at the game and Demps didn't stand out as being poor. Gülce did earlier although Sheffield said we were 'great' in that aspect. Haha |
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Post by robtearle on Sept 27, 2022 22:21:42 GMT -5
Demps played the back row in Florida game? News to me. She definitely served. That was important to the comeback in the 3rd. They couldn’t handle her looping serves for some reason. When I see that, I begin to think training everyone to serve in the same way is not the best idea. Demps had a four point serving run late in the third, played the entire fourth set and had a three point serving run and then served the final five points of the set. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2022 22:26:24 GMT -5
She definitely served. That was important to the comeback in the 3rd. They couldn’t handle her looping serves for some reason. When I see that, I begin to think training everyone to serve in the same way is not the best idea. Demps had a four point serving run late in the third, played the entire fourth set and had a three point serving run and then served the final five points of the set. Refresh my memory, in the 4th set did she play all 6 rotations or just front row and serve? We kicked butt in that set so yeh Demps 🙂 |
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Post by badgerbreath on Sept 27, 2022 22:57:20 GMT -5
I don’t know if people remember, but in 2017 the badgers started to do better right at the end of the season. They took a set off Stanford in the sweet 16. In 2018, it felt like they were still trying to figure out how best to get the balance between Rettke and the rest of the attack right. They were also susceptible to dominant hitters, and to getting served out of matches. That continued until early 2019, until a switch went off during the PSU match. In other words, it was a long haul. But there were a lotta injuries and a less attacking talent than there is now. The 2017 freshmen won a national championship last year. Yeah. Kinda my point. |
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Post by robtearle on Sept 27, 2022 23:11:42 GMT -5
Demps had a four point serving run late in the third, played the entire fourth set and had a three point serving run and then served the final five points of the set. Refresh my memory, in the 4th set did she play all 6 rotations or just front row and serve? We kicked butt in that set so yeh Demps 🙂 I pulled up the video to be sure: Late in the third after a Franklin error, Demps replaced Franklin at left, front row. After the next UW point, Demps rotated back to serve and went on a four point serving run. Stayed in after having lost the serve and immediately shanked the subsequent Florida serve to put the set at 24-24. Franklin immediately came back in and played back row through the end of the set at 28-26. In the fourth set, Demps started in the front row at left, played across the front, then served when she rotated back. After her serve was other, Franklin replaced her and played the rest of the way across the back. When it was time to rotate to the front, Demps replaced Franklin; that is, Franklin was Demps; DS with Demps doing the serving, 3 and 1/2 rotations for Demps and 2 and 1/2 for Franklin. In the fifth set, Franklin played six-rotation, with Gregorski coming in (twice) as her serving sub; Demps did not play in the 5th. In retrospect, it's easy to say that Demps could have been that serving sub, etc. |
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Post by robtearle on Sept 27, 2022 23:13:20 GMT -5
The 2017 freshmen won a national championship last year. Yeah. Kinda my point. It felt to me like you left it short, didn't hammer home the point by stopping at 2019; you set a 31 and I felt like it needed to be slammed to the court. |
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Post by badgerbreath on Sept 27, 2022 23:45:02 GMT -5
It felt to me like you left it short, didn't hammer home the point by stopping at 2019; you set a 31 and I felt like it needed to be slammed to the court. I feel like everyone is pretty aware they won a NC last year. That fact is coloring every take on this year's team. So it felt like it didn't need repeating. |
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Post by robtearle on Sept 27, 2022 23:54:18 GMT -5
It felt to me like you left it short, didn't hammer home the point by stopping at 2019; you set a 31 and I felt like it needed to be slammed to the court. I feel like everyone is pretty aware they won a NC last year. That fact is coloring every take on this year's team. So it felt like it didn't need repeating. But does everyone know or recall that "2017" was the start of Hilley, Rettke, Loberg, etc? I thought making sure that a more casual reader might need a more explicit reminder. Either way... |
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Post by tablealgebra on Sept 28, 2022 1:09:48 GMT -5
She definitely served. That was important to the comeback in the 3rd. They couldn’t handle her looping serves for some reason. When I see that, I begin to think training everyone to serve in the same way is not the best idea. Served yes but a poor game passing? Like to see the stats. I was at the game and Demps didn't stand out as being poor. Gülce did earlier although Sheffield said we were 'great' in that aspect. Haha We gonna have this passing discussion again? Demps was able to save our butts against Florida despite the fact that her passing was suspect (remember, passing is specifically making first contact after the ball is served). Sheffield subbed her out in the back row during the fourth set purely because Franklin is a better passer and he wanted better passing in those three rotations where Demps wasn't helping out by playing front row. But I think that passing is actually not a problem long-term for us; at least, not for a team which runs a 6-2 (where you expect passing to suffer a bit for the lack of DS's). The passing can get patched up in a month or two, especially taking care of the seam between Franklin and GG (neither is a great passer but between the two of them they can be respectable and keep us in system the majority of the time). And if GG doesn't improve, then we will see Bramschrieber get a shot at Libero. I'm much more concerned about the fact that the setters don't seem to be able to run a good offense from good but not perfect passes/digs; that seems like something that may not be fixable, or could take years to develop. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 28, 2022 4:26:14 GMT -5
Served yes but a poor game passing? Like to see the stats. I was at the game and Demps didn't stand out as being poor. Gülce did earlier although Sheffield said we were 'great' in that aspect. Haha We gonna have this passing discussion again? Demps was able to save our butts against Florida despite the fact that her passing was suspect (remember, passing is specifically making first contact after the ball is served). Sheffield subbed her out in the back row during the fourth set purely because Franklin is a better passer and he wanted better passing in those three rotations where Demps wasn't helping out by playing front row. But I think that passing is actually not a problem long-term for us; at least, not for a team which runs a 6-2 (where you expect passing to suffer a bit for the lack of DS's). The passing can get patched up in a month or two, especially taking care of the seam between Franklin and GG (neither is a great passer but between the two of them they can be respectable and keep us in system the majority of the time). And if GG doesn't improve, then we will see Bramschrieber get a shot at Libero. I'm much more concerned about the fact that the setters don't seem to be able to run a good offense from good but not perfect passes/digs; that seems like something that may not be fixable, or could take years to develop. Jades current role in 6-2 isn't for the back row but she has held her own there overall I think. its funny how much shade Demps gets for as poor people say she is at passing, Orzol is a terrible server, and Gülce is a huge serving target ( has put up her share of poor 1st contacts). But you wouldn't know it reading this forum as a whole. After the Florida and Minnesota games I just don't think setting is good enough against the top teams and we will be left lacking the remainder of this season. |
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