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Post by volleyguy on Jul 13, 2022 19:57:00 GMT -5
Not to make this something it’s not, but as a country, we have GOT to start coaching passing seriously at the upper club level. And then those skills should be honed in on even MORE by college coaches, who we should get “in the know” of exactly how the USANT trains passing. Either that, or we need some seriously more in depth USAV trainings at all the age groups. club/ncaa isnt designed to develop pro players. its not going to happen unless someone takes the initiative on their own. Who at the club level, for that matter, at the NCAA level, can teach passing well? I can count them on one hand, or less. |
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Post by CAI BIN MUST GO on Jul 13, 2022 20:13:49 GMT -5
that's why turkish league is superior |
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Post by volleyguy on Jul 13, 2022 20:18:07 GMT -5
Not to make this something it’s not, but as a country, we have GOT to start coaching passing seriously at the upper club level. And then those skills should be honed in on even MORE by college coaches, who we should get “in the know” of exactly how the USANT trains passing. Either that, or we need some seriously more in depth USAV trainings at all the age groups. Just tired of so many great players being held back by arguably the most fundamental skill:/ This is the wrong take. If you want to start developing international passers then USA needs to change the ball we compete with at the junior/collegiate level. There’s very few national team programs with better passing technique than USA, but other programs have seniors with infinitely better touch and read on the ball because they’ve competed with it for so much longer. The USA passing technique, derived from GM2, is the problem. It has trickled down and is almost ubiquitous. Yes, using the same ball might improve on what we have now, but the ball is not the most significant problem. We can work backwards. Which top national teams have consistently good passers? Japan, Brazil, sometimes Italy, USA sometimes (after our players play abroad). It's really hard to become an elite passer after the early 20's. It just doesn't happen that often. |
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Post by taxidea on Jul 13, 2022 21:20:23 GMT -5
Coaches and players would riot… but why not reduce the number of substitutions allowed per set in NCAA play, thereby forcing more 6-rotation utilization for example, and immediately changing the game such that development of more well rounded player skillsets become a necessity, rather than a nice to have.
Just throwing it out there.
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Post by dodger on Jul 13, 2022 21:35:23 GMT -5
Coaches and players would riot… but why not reduce the number of substitutions allowed per set in NCAA play, thereby forcing more 6-rotation utilization for example, and immediately changing the game such that development of more well rounded player skillsets become a necessity, rather than a nice to have. Just throwing it out there. Past rules: 12 subs no libero: had to train OH and MH to play all around: but alas women’s coach's pushed rules to play more players increase participation: then the FIVB adds libero with goal of longer more entertaining rally’s: womens college adds libero increases subs: and the age of sub and specialization makes training(SR) for teams poor prep for our womens national team. Your argument is in almost all meetings since very early ‘80’s ; even late ‘70’s: the men have held fairly consistent to international rules but not women! Alas your point has been made for last 40 years but women’s rules in US continue to be more generous in sub: guaranteeing greater specialization: often at young ages clubs removing best athletes from SR because the can play MH at early club years thus getting underdeveloped: not because of potential: but because of early positional specialization! |
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Post by taxidea on Jul 13, 2022 21:46:29 GMT -5
Coaches and players would riot… but why not reduce the number of substitutions allowed per set in NCAA play, thereby forcing more 6-rotation utilization for example, and immediately changing the game such that development of more well rounded player skillsets become a necessity, rather than a nice to have. Just throwing it out there. Past rules: 12 subs no libero: had to train OH and MH to play all around: but alas women’s coach's pushed rules to play more players increase participation: then the FIVB adds libero with goal of longer more entertaining rally’s: womens college adds libero increases subs: and the age of sub and specialization makes training(SR) for teams poor prep for our womens national team. Your argument is in almost all meetings since very early ‘80’s ; even late ‘70’s: the men have held fairly consistent to international rules but not women! Alas your point has been made for last 40 years but women’s rules in US continue to be more generous in sub: guaranteeing greater specialization: often at young ages clubs removing best athletes from SR because the can play MH at early club years thus getting underdeveloped: not because of potential: but because of early positional specialization! +1…hence my comment alluding to riots. Sometimes revolution is needed. Thanks |
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Post by Pipe Attack on Jul 13, 2022 21:53:01 GMT -5
I don't really think anyone really is special at training passers. It's who they recruit. And anyway, NCAA style ball (especially if you're from a power conference) - have people that can kill the ball (6'3"-6"5") would be ideal and sub them out in the back row for a better ball handler. The more people that can enter the game, the merrier! That's why the premier programs can have giant rosters.
NCAA is all about winning and who has the $$$. No one is going to suddenly have the realization - hey, we need to develop passers for the national team - to be honest, college coaches could care less. You lose your elite status, you risk not getting the recruits you want .... and then your program slips. The main objective is the W.
But anyway, that doesn't seem to have hurt USA program t0o much. I guess passing is more developed at the junior level anyway. If you can pass well, and you're tall enough and you can terminate, that will be your job. You'll probably be an All American, play pro and be called to the national team.
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Post by jwvolley on Jul 13, 2022 21:56:50 GMT -5
Many on here will disagree with me, but I enjoy being a fan of the sport and being able to watch both "versions", for lack of a better term.
There were 340 or so NCAA Div. 1 programs I believe last year, with an average of 17 roster athletes. It's pretty clear that as an entity it doesn't exist for the purpose of producing USAV NT members.
I love watching all-around players. It's a lot of fun to see in any National team or pro match and even the college players who are capable of playing 6 rotations and contributing that way to the team, I'm a fan.
But there have been a lot of smalls over the years that I have loved watching as well. If substitutions were significantly more limited in order to allow for more/most hitters staying on the court, there are plenty of other players that wouldn't have been able to make the impact they did and I would've missed out.
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Post by dokterrudi on Jul 13, 2022 22:00:51 GMT -5
I do think that passing overall has improved in the NCAA a little, it’s better then it was 4 or 5 years, not a lot so maybe that means the word is slowly getting out but I like the idea of reducing subs in the NCAA.
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Post by dokterrudi on Jul 13, 2022 22:04:25 GMT -5
Not to make this something it’s not, but as a country, we have GOT to start coaching passing seriously at the upper club level. And then those skills should be honed in on even MORE by college coaches, who we should get “in the know” of exactly how the USANT trains passing. Either that, or we need some seriously more in depth USAV trainings at all the age groups. Just tired of so many great players being held back by arguably the most fundamental skill:/ This is the wrong take. If you want to start developing international passers then USA needs to change the ball we compete with at the junior/collegiate level. There’s very few national team programs with better passing technique than USA, but other programs have seniors with infinitely better touch and read on the ball because they’ve competed with it for so much longer. You’re correct here but I don’t know if I can see that happening, so much money involved, but you never know. |
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trojansc
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Post by trojansc on Jul 14, 2022 2:57:20 GMT -5
Many on here will disagree with me, but I enjoy being a fan of the sport and being able to watch both "versions", for lack of a better term. There were 340 or so NCAA Div. 1 programs I believe last year, with an average of 17 roster athletes. It's pretty clear that as an entity it doesn't exist for the purpose of producing USAV NT members. I love watching all-around players. It's a lot of fun to see in any National team or pro match and even the college players who are capable of playing 6 rotations and contributing that way to the team, I'm a fan. But there have been a lot of smalls over the years that I have loved watching as well. If substitutions were significantly more limited in order to allow for more/most hitters staying on the court, there are plenty of other players that wouldn't have been able to make the impact they did and I would've missed out. I love to see the alterations of teams utilizing their substitutions in very different way. Like, to the extreme, it's interesting to see a team DS all 3 of their pin hitters. (it's even more fun when you see that team subsequently have 0 backrow attack options and then play against a team who has all 3 of their pin hitters play 6-ros) More commonly seen is a 6-2 with DS'ing one OH Both of those above can run into sub trouble. I also like when teams can play without a setter more often or use a blocking sub multiple times. Wish we saw more middles play all around, especially if a DS is used for a pin hitter. It's rare but can happen. |
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Post by douglass9 on Jul 14, 2022 7:16:13 GMT -5
There is a title 9 fight going on right now in ncaa volleyball. The coaches want the same rules for volleyball as men's football. (pay for summer school, more time for the coaches to work with the player's) For the first time volleyball will be included in big ten media day. We might look back at this time and seeing the sport become the leading women's sport in the country. It certainly is in Minnesota.
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Post by avid 2.0 on Jul 15, 2022 23:45:03 GMT -5
where did @newvolley go :/
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Post by CAI BIN MUST GO on Jul 15, 2022 23:50:21 GMT -5
where did @newvolley go :/ madden ate him |
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Post by avid 2.0 on Jul 17, 2022 14:51:59 GMT -5
Preliminary VNL stats - Some of the blocking stats are incorrect. I fixed the ones that I knew. (Also FIVB's attacking stats aren't perfect). In general, should be a decent ball park number. (also my math could be wrong lol) Outside HittersFrantti: 4.57 kps, .415, .71 b/s, .07 aces/set Frantti finished the VNL hitting 4.59 kps, .429 lol. #KarchOut |
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