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Post by robtearle on Dec 7, 2022 13:58:41 GMT -5
If you want to pick on a sport that does it differently, look at American football. One scores a touchdown if just the tip of the ball touches the vertical plane defined by the goal line — the entire ball doesn’t have to cross the goal line. Ironically, it is even possible to score a touchdown without the ball ever actually being in the endzone at all. For instance, a receiver reaches to catch a ball that is thrown along the sideline, but keeps both feet in the endzone when making the catch, before stepping out, with the ball never actually entering the endzone itself. I'm pretty sure that would still count at a TD. I guess that's theoretically possible, but the quarterback would have to sidearm the ball while being over the sideline without having touched out-of-bounds, such that the trajectory of the ball stayed outside the sideline and didn't cross over the pylon at the corner of the end zone (and I'm not even sure that would be a touchdown). If the ball were to cross over the pylon, it would be considered 'in the endzone'. Say a ball carrier has the ball in his hand and is extending it out as he crosses over the goal line: the ball must travel inside or over the pylon for it to be a touchdown; if it goes around the pylon to the out-of-bounds side, even though the runner's body enters the endzone - maybe even falls to the ground in the endzone - if the ball was outside the pylon as he crossed the goal line, it is not a touchdown. It would be marked out somewhere inside the one yard line.
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Post by mikegarrison on Dec 7, 2022 14:02:56 GMT -5
In the World Cup, there would not be any controversy as to whether a goal has been scored. There is a chip embedded in the ball and sensors along the goal line that can tell you definitively whether the entire ball entered the goal. But it is not practical to do this along the couple hundred meters of side and end lines, so in rare instances you get controversies like the Japanese goal. Bottom line, the “in” v “out” definitions are the same in VB and soccer. It is just that the scoring actions are defined in opposing ways in the two sports. In VB ones scores by having the ball land IN the field of play, whereas in soccer one scores by impelling the ball into the goal, OUT of the field of play. If you want to pick on a sport that does it differently, look at American football. One scores a touchdown if just the tip of the ball touches the vertical plane defined by the goal line — the entire ball doesn’t have to cross the goal line. How can a single chip be used for that? Edit: fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-world-cups-new-high-tech-ball-will-change-soccer-forever/OK, that's a little more than "a chip". It's got a couple of different sensors that are suspended in the center of the ball.
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Post by robtearle on Dec 7, 2022 14:10:55 GMT -5
And. if one wants to get really picky about it, why call it [American] football, considering how rarely a foot contacts the ball. In the early, early days, the scoring rules were very different; a field goal counted more than a touchdown (and for a very short time, the 'extra point' also counted more than the touchdown itself). Beyond that, because other early rules - a penalty didn't cost five yards, etc, the punishment was turning the ball over to the other team at the spot - punting was much more common, and was thought of as an offensive weapon, changing field position in hopes of a turnover that could quickly lead to a dropkick 'try' for big points. So kicking and the kickers was MUCH more important than it is now. The star of the team was often the punter/kicker.
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Post by jayj79 on Dec 7, 2022 14:15:33 GMT -5
I guess that's theoretically possible, but the quarterback would have to sidearm the ball while being over the sideline without having touched out-of-bounds, such that the trajectory of the ball stayed outside the sideline and didn't cross over the pylon at the corner of the end zone (and I'm not even sure that would be a touchdown). If the ball were to cross over the pylon, it would be considered 'in the endzone'. It doesn't really matter what the ball does when it is in the air and not in the possession of a player. Say a ball carrier has the ball in his hand and is extending it out as he crosses over the goal line: the ball must travel inside or over the pylon for it to be a touchdown; if it goes around the pylon to the out-of-bounds side, even though the runner's body enters the endzone - maybe even falls to the ground in the endzone - if the ball was outside the pylon as he crossed the goal line, it is not a touchdown. It would be marked out somewhere inside the one yard line. Are you certain about that? Yes, if the ballcarrier makes contact with the grounds out-of-bounds, then sure, it isn't a TD. But if the ballcarrier crossed the goal line while extending the ball outside the pylon, but then brought it into the endzone afterward (prior to contacting out-of-bounds ground themselves), I'd bet that would be considered a touchdown. But I am not actually an official, so I could be wrong.
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Post by robtearle on Dec 7, 2022 14:17:45 GMT -5
I guess that's theoretically possible, but the quarterback would have to sidearm the ball while being over the sideline without having touched out-of-bounds, such that the trajectory of the ball stayed outside the sideline and didn't cross over the pylon at the corner of the end zone (and I'm not even sure that would be a touchdown). If the ball were to cross over the pylon, it would be considered 'in the endzone'. It doesn't really matter what the ball does when it is in the air and not in the possession of a player. Say a ball carrier has the ball in his hand and is extending it out as he crosses over the goal line: the ball must travel inside or over the pylon for it to be a touchdown; if it goes around the pylon to the out-of-bounds side, even though the runner's body enters the endzone - maybe even falls to the ground in the endzone - if the ball was outside the pylon as he crossed the goal line, it is not a touchdown. It would be marked out somewhere inside the one yard line. Are you certain about that? Yes, if the ballcarrier makes contact with the grounds out-of-bounds, then sure, it isn't a TD. But if the ballcarrier crossed the goal line while extending the ball outside the pylon, but then brought it into the endzone afterward (prior to contacting out-of-bounds ground themselves), I'd bet that would be considered a touchdown. But I am not actually an official, so I could be wrong. It matters if the 'question' is a TD with the ball never 'entering' the endzone. Yes, I'm certain of that. (And if he "then brought it into the endzone afterward" it would have entered the endzone. And again, the question was the idea of a TD being scored with the ball never entering the endzone.)
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Post by jayj79 on Dec 7, 2022 14:18:24 GMT -5
And. if one wants to get really picky about it, why call it [American] football, considering how rarely a foot contacts the ball. My friends, family and I all call it "throwball" some of my friends and family use that term to refer to the attack style of certain volleyball players, despite the officials only occasionally calling them on it
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Post by jayj79 on Dec 7, 2022 14:25:39 GMT -5
in hopes of a turnover that could quickly lead to a dropkick 'try' for big points. I wish the actual dropkick (dropping the ball and kicking it as it hits the ground) was brought back into the game of football perhaps like how the Arena Football League at one point did: drop kick FGs were worth 4 points and drop kick XPs worth 2 admittedly, instances of that actually happening were rare as no one really practices the skill of drop kicking the modern football (the pointed end makes the bounce much more unpredictable than the more rounded ends that used to be)
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Post by robtearle on Dec 7, 2022 14:36:37 GMT -5
in hopes of a turnover that could quickly lead to a dropkick 'try' for big points. I wish the actual dropkick (dropping the ball and kicking it as it hits the ground) was brought back into the game of football perhaps like how the Arena Football League at one point did: drop kick FGs were worth 4 points and drop kick XPs worth 2 admittedly, instances of that actually happening were rare as no one really practices the skill of drop kicking the modern football (the pointed end makes the bounce much more unpredictable than the more rounded ends that used to be) There's a book written by Dave Revsine - the Big Ten Network anchor - called "The Opening Kickoff" from a few years ago that is about the early history of college football. It alternates chapters between general descriptions and chapters about a guy named Pat O'Dea, who was an Australian playing at Wisconsin as the kicker/punter. O'Dea was maybe the first college football 'superstar'; supposedly made a 60-yard dropkick against Northwestern in 1897. The book is pretty good.
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Post by mikegarrison on Dec 7, 2022 14:51:45 GMT -5
The weird thing about football is that when it comes to the sidelines or the back line, what matters is whether the player's feet are in bounds, not whether the ball is in bounds. But when it comes to the goal line, now it is where the ball is positioned and not where the player is positioned.
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Post by jayj79 on Dec 7, 2022 15:24:30 GMT -5
The weird thing about football is that when it comes to the sidelines or the back line, what matters is whether the player's feet are in bounds, not whether the ball is in bounds. But when it comes to the goal line, now it is where the ball is positioned and not where the player is positioned. oh, there are plenty of weird things about football for instance, the fact that if a kickoff returner can field a kickoff with one (or more) feet touching the sideline, the kicker will be flagged for a free kick out of bounds, even if that kick never would have actually gone out of bounds itself.
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Post by skullars on Dec 7, 2022 16:08:03 GMT -5
Soccer, American Football, & Volleyball are all different sports and therefore set their own rules. The argument that any rules of one sport should transfer to any other sport is specious.
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Post by robtearle on Dec 7, 2022 16:11:09 GMT -5
The weird thing about football is that when it comes to the sidelines or the back line, what matters is whether the player's feet are in bounds, not whether the ball is in bounds. But when it comes to the goal line, now it is where the ball is positioned and not where the player is positioned. oh, there are plenty of weird things about football for instance, the fact that if a kickoff returner can field a kickoff with one (or more) feet touching the sideline, the kicker will be flagged for a free kick out of bounds, even if that kick never would have actually gone out of bounds itself. The first player I can remember doing it was Randall Cobb, for the Packers. The kickoff goes very near the sideline. If he catches it and then steps out-of-bounds, Packers' ball at the 10 yard line or whatever. But instead he quite intentionally steps out of bounds, then reaches back to catch the ball. Kickoff out of bounds, Packers' ball at the 40 yard line. Brilliant play.
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Post by skullars on Dec 7, 2022 16:12:46 GMT -5
Where exactly is this "portal" you speak of?
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Post by bounce22 on Dec 7, 2022 20:48:33 GMT -5
Did Wilson perish at sea or was he also rescued?
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Post by jayj79 on Dec 7, 2022 20:54:58 GMT -5
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