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Post by volleyguy on Sept 19, 2023 23:58:14 GMT -5
Argentina takes set 2, 25-22.
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trojansc
Legend
All-VolleyTalk 1st Team (2023, 2022, 2021, 2020, 2019, 2018, 2017), All-VolleyTalk 2nd Team (2016), 2021, 2019 Fantasy League Champion, 2020 Fantasy League Runner Up, 2022 2nd Runner Up
Posts: 31,219 
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Post by trojansc on Sept 19, 2023 23:59:49 GMT -5
Argentina is fun to watch. They look sooooooooo much better.
DOM-MEX about to start. 3-0 win Reinas Del Caribe, please.
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Post by newbeach on Sept 20, 2023 0:02:53 GMT -5
Shannon’s to do list: (1) Find someone who can teach passing and let them run ALL practices - this is non-negotiable and, if not adhered to, bun privileges will be revoked (2) Miss the team bus before each match Vinny should coach full-time 😉 (3) Ensure assistant coaches have access to flammables and “go over” game plans make the game plans instead of Winzer and go over it with her. (4) Contract short term laryngitis before any time out or changeover - see #2 (5) Leave Maglio on the floor at all times now and let her run pipes so she can get more than 2.5 swings per match - thank you (6) Maybe prevent a major injury and flatten out the approach on White’s slides -yikes, agree Seriously, these poor women deserve a shot not just at qualifying, but at building something great 4 years from now. It was another obvious display of how our passing (other issues also but passing is the big one) will not allow us to compete with the best teams. They just can’t consistently match the OOS play of the top nations in the world. No matter what the flaws are with Winzer’s coaching, and there’s probably one or two 😂, she should be able to identify the obvious; if you don’t have the ability to do something then enlist help. There’s no shame in doing that I don’t think. Prayer should not be the cornerstone if a program I guess that is why she had a ponytail instead of a bun in the last match! 😂 It is too bad that Winzer has not done anything to improve the team's passing. Also, why does she not making more adjustments to the passing line? How is Howe (see what I did there?) still on the court? Her plus/minus at times has to be bad and the offense she contributes isn't worth the liability. Would it not make more sense to have Mitrovic out there to provide a little better passing? Her offense isn't as dynamic as Howe's (reckless abandonment) but isn't as much of a liability in other areas. Perhaps, King would run the middle more? 😂 Mitrovic and Maglio could make up for any offense provided by Howe without the liability. Mitrovic needs a little grace to make a mistake or two before being yanked. Howe should come off the bench when the team needs a spark or needs to take risks. I know the dig stats are not super accurate, but Howe has the lowest dig percentage on the team with 7-11-25, 28%, (and her reception is, I think generous at 1--4-56 17.86, but it could be worse if teams didn't target Gray... 😢)...and her dig % is pretty much the lowest % from all players at the tournament (all three pools)... only 6 players out of all players have a lower dig % but they all had less than 5 digs. For comparison: Mitrovic 5-2-8, 62.50%, Gray 23-12-41, 56.10%, Maglio 11-2-15, 73.33 % KVR, Jost, and King are all around mid-50%. |
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Post by volleyguy on Sept 20, 2023 0:03:44 GMT -5
Argentina is fun to watch. They look sooooooooo much better. DOM-MEX about to start. 3-0 win Reinas Del Caribe, please. I always thought Argentina was a sleeper that just needed some coaching and organization. |
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Post by anastasia1 on Sept 20, 2023 0:07:05 GMT -5
a really good crowd for DOM-MEX
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Post by newbeach on Sept 20, 2023 0:07:51 GMT -5
also like? What did gio even have to do? I’m not saying he did a bad job but when your team is just that much better on paper he didn’t have to do anything special lmao. Winzer was very bad tho. Making Busa the serving target is terrible prepDid she do any prep at all? I have to wonder... No. I think Gio is not as bad as @madden55 thinks. I can't speak to his player management (and all the messiness in Turkiye), but that is a different matter than technical knowledge. I don't think he is that bad. He at least comes with a game plan in hand, Winzer has a blank clipboard. |
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Post by newbeach on Sept 20, 2023 0:11:50 GMT -5
Shannon’s to do list: (1) Find someone who can teach passing and let them run ALL practices - this is non-negotiable and, if not adhered to, bun privileges will be revoked (2) Miss the team bus before each match (3) Ensure assistant coaches have access to flammables and “go over” game plans (4) Contract short term laryngitis before any time out or changeover (5) Leave Maglio on the floor at all times now and let her run pipes so she can get more than 2.5 swings per match (6) Maybe prevent a major injury and flatten out the approach on White’s slides Seriously, these poor women deserve a shot not just at qualifying, but at building something great 4 years from now. It was another obvious display of how our passing (other issues also but passing is the big one) will not allow us to compete with the best teams. They just can’t consistently match the OOS play of the top nations in the world. No matter what the flaws are with Winzer’s coaching, and there’s probably one or two 😂, she should be able to identify the obvious; if you don’t have the ability to do something then enlist help. There’s no shame in doing that I don’t think. Prayer should not be the cornerstone if a program Hopefully Maglio heads to the beach game sooner rather than later if she’s got potential there. She already has some of the best defence on this Canadian team when she’s serving. She was a 3x All-American on the beach (2 x indoor) for Hawaii. I think she will probably go that route if they don't qualify, but don't quote me on it! 😂 |
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Post by ironhammer on Sept 20, 2023 0:28:15 GMT -5
Did she do any prep at all? I have to wonder... No. I think Gio is not as bad as @madden55 thinks. I can't speak to his player management (and all the messiness in Turkiye), but that is a different matter than technical knowledge. I don't think he is that bad. He at least comes with a game plan in hand, Winzer has a blank clipboard. Guidetti is not bad at all. If you look at his record, he has long list of accomplishments and leading his club to championships, at least at the professional league level. He seem to have encountered some initial difficulties when he switched from coaching Turkey to Serbia, probably because the Serbians were not used to his coaching style. That in itself is not necessarily unusual, since there often may be an "adjustment period" for a team as a new coach takes over. That would explain Serbia's underperformance at the VNL. But it seems clear Serbia has worked out most of their coaching issues now. |
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Post by volleyguy on Sept 20, 2023 0:35:52 GMT -5
No. I think Gio is not as bad as @madden55 thinks. I can't speak to his player management (and all the messiness in Turkiye), but that is a different matter than technical knowledge. I don't think he is that bad. He at least comes with a game plan in hand, Winzer has a blank clipboard. Guidetti is not bad at all. If you look at his record, he has long list of accomplishments and leading his club to championships, at least at the professional league level. He seen to have encountered some initial difficulties when he switched from coaching Turkey to Serbia, probably because the Serbians were not used to his coaching style. That in itself is not necessarily unusual, since there often may be an "adjustment period" for a team as a new coach takes over. That would explain Serbia's underperformance at the VNL. But it seems clear Serbia has worked out most of their coaching issues now. I think it was more a question of Gio adjusting to the Serbians. In this tournament, he is letting his assistant do a lot of the talking in the huddle. And of course, there is no reason to mention Winzer and Gio in the same sentence unless they're coaching against each other. |
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Post by ironhammer on Sept 20, 2023 0:44:52 GMT -5
Guidetti is not bad at all. If you look at his record, he has long list of accomplishments and leading his club to championships, at least at the professional league level. He seen to have encountered some initial difficulties when he switched from coaching Turkey to Serbia, probably because the Serbians were not used to his coaching style. That in itself is not necessarily unusual, since there often may be an "adjustment period" for a team as a new coach takes over. That would explain Serbia's underperformance at the VNL. But it seems clear Serbia has worked out most of their coaching issues now. In this tournament, he is letting his assistant do a lot of the talking in the huddle. And of course, there is no reason to mention Winzer and Gio in the same sentence unless they're coaching against each other. Well, there was mutual adjustment from both the players and the coach, let's put it that way. No reason to mention Winzer and Guidetti in the same sentence? I suppose...unless one wants to point out what a gap in coaching ability existed between Winzer and the opposing team's coach. One was an amateur, the other a seasoned professional. |
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Post by volleyguy on Sept 20, 2023 0:47:35 GMT -5
I think it was more a question of Gio adjusting to the Serbians. In this tournament, he is letting his assistant do a lot of the talking in the huddle. And of course, there is no reason to mention Winzer and Gio in the same sentence unless they're coaching against each other. Well, there was mutual adjustment from both the players and the coach, let's put it that way. No reason to mention Winzer and Guidetti in the same sentence? I suppose...unless one wants to point out what a gap in coaching ability existed between Winzer and the opposing team's coach. One was an amateur, the other a seasoned professional. That's exactly what that sentence meant--there's no comparison between Winzer and Guidetti in terms of coaching ability, experience or results. |
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trojansc
Legend
All-VolleyTalk 1st Team (2023, 2022, 2021, 2020, 2019, 2018, 2017), All-VolleyTalk 2nd Team (2016), 2021, 2019 Fantasy League Champion, 2020 Fantasy League Runner Up, 2022 2nd Runner Up
Posts: 31,219
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Post by trojansc on Sept 20, 2023 0:52:55 GMT -5
Mexico fights hard in the 2nd set - but can't close it out. 28-26 DOM takes S2 and a 2-0 lead in the match. Peralta's been playing for Brayelin.
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Post by newbeach on Sept 20, 2023 1:40:28 GMT -5
Can you put Canada down anymore? Jeez. Canada is not as bad as this match or tonight. That said, they have some serious issues that are not being addressed and the coaching or lack there of, is atrocious ... if you only knew the half of it. They don't stand a chance because they are not properly prepared and other teams have scouted them and have an actual game plan. Canada has no game plan (at least not one that makes sense). On a good day, with Gray playing well and if KVR could get back to her best form, if King would utilize Maglio even a little (who got a whopping 3 lousy sets), they can be competitive (with a little luck, tbf) despite the coaching holding them back. Some of these athletes are just as good as top players on other teams but they are being held back. Serbia is not going to hold back and why would they? I am fairly certain that Canada knows that Serbia with Bosko, in particular, is an extremely tough match. That doesn't mean they shouldn't go in expecting to take a set off them or possibly win. Bosko has had her share of ups and downs. Uzelac didn't exactly play well today. The Serbian team is obviously more complete (how many have Olympic experience?). Guidetti has been getting the team used to his system and he has a game plan for Canada. Winzer has nothing but bad game plans. She is holding the team back. Even the players get confused by what she asks them to do at times. No one but some clowns on this board, actually think that Winzer is anything but a high school-level coach. It is such a disgrace to the girls that have some talent that they brought on Winzer as a coach. I can't even...another coach would have them more organized and coached. They literally do not get the coaching and have been relying on their athleticism for some time. This is why they look disorganized out there, because no one is coaching them! I feel bad mostly for Alexa because I know she would like to go to the Olympics like her sister, and I don't know if she or some of the players will bother to stick around for another 4 years. This is the forever story of Volleyball Canada...good athletes that leave the team because VC doesn't invest in the coaching. The athletes get discouraged and leave. They play only club or switch to beach volleyball. They are never properly supported. My apologies for giving the impression that I was kicking Canada when they were already down. Its just my habit of giving...blunt comments. No hard feelings I hope. Yes Serbia is certainly not perfect and Uzelac wasn't necessarily at her best. But they got Boskovic, and she was delivering, and that was all that matters really. And yeah I suppose players like Gray would be in demand from certain other NTs, although that would bring up the complicated nationality issue and the whole "patriotism" thing. Winzer, she graduated from UBC and got her prior playing and coaching experience from...Australia, if I am not mistaken? I thought UBC was supposed to have a pretty decent volleyball program (for Canada anyway)? Although Australia is not exactly known for being a hotbed for indoor women volleyball (but they are pretty decent at beach volleyball, no doubt their mild sunny climate and plenty of nice beaches play a role in that). So I am not sure just how qualified she is to coach Canada. But if cash is short at Volleyball Canada, then I guess maybe they couldn't afford to hire a better coach? Either way, its clear she was out-class by Guidetti. Its clear who was the better coach in the match. I think we can agree on that? No worries. It is just tough to hear especially after a loss. 😢 I was never as delusional to think they were at the level of teams (but you hope for an upset)! I was more hoping that they somehow manage to take that 10th spot. It's close, but still so far. I am starting to come to terms that this team will likely not qualify for the Olympics (unless they get healthy and can pull off some miracles at the VNL with a little luck). If they don't qualify, it is possible that Gray quits (or even takes a couple years off), and Maglio heads to the beach. I did hear at one time that King was planning on retiring after 2024, but I don't think that is happening now. Cross, will likely be gone unless she recovers well from her knee injury, and White is 29, so who knows. Van Buskirk should fill in for Maglio (but is only 14 months younger and has been injury prone, so who knows if she will be around until 2028, and Ogums, will likely be gone as well. It will be a new generation of players that will need some valuable experience and they will need a coach who can guide them or they may not even see the "success" of the current squad. Winzer supposedly played at UBC from 2000 to 2002. I was trying to look up her stats but they only have the 2001 roster on their website and she isn't listed. I know she was playing professional in Australia and from there they asked her to coach their national team. She returned to Canada in 2019 and started as the coach of the NextGen team, and then in 2020 was promoted to the coach of the senior team with the departure of Tom Black. Volleyball Canada could have hired a better coach for two years leading to the Olympic qualifiers (like when they hired Abbondanza), but they save money on Winzer. As a female coach, the team gets money (from somewhere though I can't remember where) to coach. Maybe another Canadian fan knows this? I am not sure when (or for how long) Winzer coached the NT in Australia, but I saw one article (a 2017-18 Annual report) where she was coaching the women's NT in 2017-2018. They were hoping to compete in the VNL and the first phase of the "Challenge League was an Asian Qualification tournament. Four teams were entered: Kazakhstan, Philippines, Chinese Taipei and Australia". They played warm up matches against Slovakia, Austria and a Polish youth team. In the Asian qualification tournament, they did not record a win ...Khazakhstan earned the spot, but dropped out at the last minute and Australia was the only one who accepted the spot on short notice. The teams played Puerto Rico, Bulgaria and a Peru under 23 team (in Peru) but did not record a win. They also played in the Thai Senior Club Championships, where they did not record a win. They then played in the AVC Cup for the top ten ranked teams in Asia. They improved their ranking from 9th to 7th. "It was a relatively small but important step for the Asian Championship in 2019...and the long term aim for this team and HC Shannon Winzer to qualify for the 2024 Olympics"... Again, 2019 Winzer returns to Canada and coaches the NextGen team and then in 2020 is named Head Coach of Canada's Senior Women's National Team" (following the departure of Tom Black and previously Marcello Abbondanza). The core players were chosen under Abbondanza (who coached 2017-2018) and Black (2019-2020). |
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Post by c4ndlelight on Sept 20, 2023 2:20:44 GMT -5
How does FIVB not see an issue with how non-competitive these tournaments are? Where is the drama/excitement?
Qualify the continental champs first (to get the giants out of the field), and then have a smaller field of 12/18 more evenly matched teams fight it out. That would be great volleyball!
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Post by HandeBallerdın on Sept 20, 2023 3:39:10 GMT -5
Guidetti is not bad at all. If you look at his record, he has long list of accomplishments and leading his club to championships, at least at the professional league level. He seen to have encountered some initial difficulties when he switched from coaching Turkey to Serbia, probably because the Serbians were not used to his coaching style. That in itself is not necessarily unusual, since there often may be an "adjustment period" for a team as a new coach takes over. That would explain Serbia's underperformance at the VNL. But it seems clear Serbia has worked out most of their coaching issues now. I think it was more a question of Gio adjusting to the Serbians. In this tournament, he is letting his assistant do a lot of the talking in the huddle. And of course, there is no reason to mention Winzer and Gio in the same sentence unless they're coaching against each other. saim pakkan should be the next big head coaching hire |
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