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Post by robtearle on Sept 2, 2024 10:08:00 GMT -5
When I noticed that neither Minn nor Stanford had a second libero dressed, the question that occurred to me was "if the first libero gets hurt, can you still have somebody quickly put on a libero jersey and replace her, or was that opportunity forfeited at the start of the set when nobody was already the designated second libero?" New rules, new questions... In the exhibition match, Kelly rotated almost all his littles through the L jersey. I believe exhibitions are played with the same rules as regular games, right? That was changing who was libero from set to set. I'm talking about mid-set. |
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Post by Snoopy on Sept 2, 2024 10:17:01 GMT -5
In the exhibition match, Kelly rotated almost all his littles through the L jersey. I believe exhibitions are played with the same rules as regular games, right? That was changing who was libero from set to set. I'm talking about mid-set. He was changing mid-set, against Louisville at least. One was in for serve-receive and they switched when WI was serving. |
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Post by twkpwrbtmlib on Sept 2, 2024 10:24:26 GMT -5
In the exhibition match, Kelly rotated almost all his littles through the L jersey. I believe exhibitions are played with the same rules as regular games, right? That was changing who was libero from set to set. I'm talking about mid-set. I think you can still replace the injured libero even if you hadn't assigned a second libero provided the injured libero doesn't return to the match. |
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Post by robtearle on Sept 2, 2024 10:40:10 GMT -5
That was changing who was libero from set to set. I'm talking about mid-set. He was changing mid-set, against Louisville at least. One was in for serve-receive and they switched when WI was serving. You guys are missing the point, missing my question. IF a team does NOT designate TWO liberos at the beginning of a set - as was the case yesterday for both Minnesota and Stanford who had only one player wearing a libero jersey, but not for Wisconsin who had two liberos - and then the only dressed libero is injured during that set, can the team then designate mid-set a second libero to replace the injured libero mid-set. Or did they forfeit that possibility by not designating a second libero at the beginning of the set, when they had the chance. |
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Post by skolgophers on Sept 2, 2024 10:47:24 GMT -5
He was changing mid-set, against Louisville at least. One was in for serve-receive and they switched when WI was serving. You guys are missing the point, missing my question. IF a team does NOT designate TWO liberos at the beginning of a set - as was the case yesterday for both Minnesota and Stanford who had only one player wearing a libero jersey, but not for Wisconsin who had two liberos - and then the only dressed libero is injured during that set, can the team then designate mid-set a second libero to replace the injured libero mid-set. Or did they forfeit that possibility by not designating a second libero at the beginning of the set, when they had the chance. I think you are missing the point. We have 3 L/DS on the roster. All 3 had “designations” in the lineup. One of which was Z(L), Thibault(DS for Grote), and Gray (serving sub for MB). There was no one else they could have designated to be a backup L as all 3 had spots in the lineup. Ng and Minatee are backup setters, not L/DS |
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Post by robtearle on Sept 2, 2024 10:52:56 GMT -5
You guys are missing the point, missing my question. IF a team does NOT designate TWO liberos at the beginning of a set - as was the case yesterday for both Minnesota and Stanford who had only one player wearing a libero jersey, but not for Wisconsin who had two liberos - and then the only dressed libero is injured during that set, can the team then designate mid-set a second libero to replace the injured libero mid-set. Or did they forfeit that possibility by not designating a second libero at the beginning of the set, when they had the chance. I think you are missing the point. We have 3 L/DS on the roster. All 3 had “designations” in the lineup. One of which was Z(L), Thibault(DS for Grote), and Gray (serving sub for MB). There was no one else they could have designated to be a backup L as all 3 had spots in the lineup. Ng and Minatee are backup setters, not L/DS My question isn't specific to Minnesota's current roster; the question occurred to me during yesterday's match, but the question is a general one. ------------------ As for the current Minn roster: Gray, Acevado, Ng, McGhie, etc, as a second libero, in case Z is getting lit up; if for no other reason than to give her a five minute mental break in a set that is 'gone', like the 4th set yesterday. (Yes, I'm aware that Gray can't be both a SS and a second libero.) |
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Post by jeepers on Sept 2, 2024 11:09:28 GMT -5
He was changing mid-set, against Louisville at least. One was in for serve-receive and they switched when WI was serving. You guys are missing the point, missing my question. IF a team does NOT designate TWO liberos at the beginning of a set - as was the case yesterday for both Minnesota and Stanford who had only one player wearing a libero jersey, but not for Wisconsin who had two liberos - and then the only dressed libero is injured during that set, can the team then designate mid-set a second libero to replace the injured libero mid-set. Or did they forfeit that possibility by not designating a second libero at the beginning of the set, when they had the chance. My understanding is that if you do not designate a second libero, the same rules as before apply where you can select a replacement if there's an injury. My understanding is also that if you are using the 2-libero system, you cannot select a replacement mid-set if there's an injury. Honestly not sure what happens if they both get injured. |
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Post by gopherhim on Sept 2, 2024 11:27:04 GMT -5
He was changing mid-set, against Louisville at least. One was in for serve-receive and they switched when WI was serving. You guys are missing the point, missing my question. IF a team does NOT designate TWO liberos at the beginning of a set - as was the case yesterday for both Minnesota and Stanford who had only one player wearing a libero jersey, but not for Wisconsin who had two liberos - and then the only dressed libero is injured during that set, can the team then designate mid-set a second libero to replace the injured libero mid-set. Or did they forfeit that possibility by not designating a second libero at the beginning of the set, when they had the chance. Based on the language in the rule book, if you designate two liberos on the lineup sheet at the beginning of a set and one gets injured, you can redesignate someone on the bench to be the second libero if you want. And if you only designate one libero on the lineup sheet, you can still redesignate in the event of injury. The rule is that you can designate up to two liberos and redesignate mid-set (or not) in the event of injury. The only time the rule book explicitly mentions a difference between one and two liberos is in the event of a libero being disqualified. If you only designated one libero for a particular set and they are disqualified, your middle has to return to the court and you use regular substitutions and can’t designate a libero until the next set. If you have a 2 libero system then the non-disqualified libero becomes your only libero until the set ends. |
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Post by jeepers on Sept 2, 2024 11:33:27 GMT -5
Is any major team using the double libero besides Wisconsin?
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Post by GoGophs on Sept 2, 2024 11:35:15 GMT -5
He was changing mid-set, against Louisville at least. One was in for serve-receive and they switched when WI was serving. You guys are missing the point, missing my question. IF a team does NOT designate TWO liberos at the beginning of a set - as was the case yesterday for both Minnesota and Stanford who had only one player wearing a libero jersey, but not for Wisconsin who had two liberos - and then the only dressed libero is injured during that set, can the team then designate mid-set a second libero to replace the injured libero mid-set. Or did they forfeit that possibility by not designating a second libero at the beginning of the set, when they had the chance. Yes, if the libero is injured, they can put someone else in the L jersey who hasn’t already been in the set. They don’t need to designate that libero ahead of time. For example, if Z was injured and Thibault was already in the set but Gray hadn’t played yet, Gray could be the libero BUT if both Gray and Thibault have already played in the set then someone else (maybe Crowl actually?) would take the L jersey. It happened a couple years ago when CC had to be taken out for concussion protocol and Gray took over since Kilkelly was already playing in the set but Gray hadnt. Does that answer it? |
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Post by uofaGRAD on Sept 2, 2024 11:39:10 GMT -5
Is any major team using the double libero besides Wisconsin? I think Pitt is (arizona isn’t “major” but we’ve been using it too) |
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Post by robtearle on Sept 2, 2024 11:44:22 GMT -5
You guys are missing the point, missing my question. IF a team does NOT designate TWO liberos at the beginning of a set - as was the case yesterday for both Minnesota and Stanford who had only one player wearing a libero jersey, but not for Wisconsin who had two liberos - and then the only dressed libero is injured during that set, can the team then designate mid-set a second libero to replace the injured libero mid-set. Or did they forfeit that possibility by not designating a second libero at the beginning of the set, when they had the chance. It happened a couple years ago when .... ... and then they changed the rules regarding liberos... |
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Post by JT on Sept 2, 2024 11:45:05 GMT -5
Okay… rule book lookup!!!  rbvl.com/VBR24.pdf#page50 (gets close, anyway) 1) You can designate 0, 1, or 2 players as L’s each set when the lineup is submitted. You are limited to that *number* (or fewer) L’s during the set. So no saying that Z is the one Libero, and then adding a second later. Only if Z were to be injured would you be able to replace her, and then she’d be out for the rest of the set, at least. (The only exception is that, if you forget to list L’s on the sheet, the coach may “without delay” correct that mistake by telling the R2 who the one or two L’s will be.) 2) Rule 12 doesn’t make it clear, but 11.3.5.5 specifically states that if a L is injured, you can designate a replacement L for her, even if she is one of two L’s. (I.e. you can designate a new L and continue to have two L’s.) 3) Fun fact rule… the L jersey(s) must be immediately distinguishable from the other players’ jerseys, but is there are two L’s, they don’t need to match. So the team wearing white, Z in maroon, and Kate in gold would be an acceptable thing, if they really wanted. |
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Post by GoGophs on Sept 2, 2024 11:48:32 GMT -5
It happened a couple years ago when .... ... and then they changed the rules regarding liberos... They didn’t change that rule though… the only thing that changed was being able to designate and use 2 liberos in a set. For teams that are not choosing to use 2 liberos, the previous lib rules still apply |
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Post by c4ndlelight on Sept 2, 2024 12:01:56 GMT -5
Is any major team using the double libero besides Wisconsin? I think Pitt is (arizona isn’t “major” but we’ve been using it too) Pitt is just using it as a serving sub, I think. |
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