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Post by 1before2 on Apr 19, 2014 17:16:13 GMT -5
Last year's BJNC 16's: lowest CA team finished 21st (out of 36). 22nd thru 36th was 8 teams from Midwest and 6 from East coast. Top 21 only saw 4 from Midwest and 2 from East Coast.
East Coast has four bid tourn for potential 12 bids, Midwest has two for 9 and Cali two for 13. The system is set up to get more teams from the East Coast. Unfortunately, as others have posted, this does dilute the field at Nationals.
For this year's 16's, I believe Milwaukee VBC is good enough to go to Nationals. Unfortunately, with more East Coast teams coming to the Chicago qualifier, they missed out on a bid and now have to cancel their annual trip to the SCVA boys classic and go to the East Coast qualifier to try and get a bid.
I didn't do an actual count, but another factor that promotes more East Coast teams getting bids is that more East Coast teams come to the Midwest events, where almost none of the Midwest teams go out East. For the East Coast teams that get bids in the Chicago qualifier, this potentially knocks out deserving Midwest teams and allows more trickle down in the East coast events. As the Cali teams don't seem to travel outside of CA for qualifiers, I'm certain there are more deserving teams that are left out.
Remember, this is the National championships, it should have the BEST teams competing, regardless of where they are from.
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Post by 1before2 on Apr 19, 2014 17:18:47 GMT -5
I get your point but as an example Coastal's 16-2 team won a bid at the BECC and almost knocked balboa bay 16's out of the BJNC. You never what's going to happen. And teams do improve by the end of the season. Nationals is a 36 team tournament so the last 6 teams are going to struggle whether they are from CA or VA. If any Californian teams want to come take one of our bids, then let them. The talent level drops off significantly after the top 8 or 10 teams in CA as well. Losing to a team 25-20, 25-16 on the first day of BJNC is considered "almost knocking them out of the tournament"?
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Post by eastcoastball on Apr 19, 2014 18:25:42 GMT -5
Last year's BJNC 16's: lowest CA team finished 21st (out of 36). 22nd thru 36th was 8 teams from Midwest and 6 from East coast. Top 21 only saw 4 from Midwest and 2 from East Coast. East Coast has four bid tourn for potential 12 bids, Midwest has two for 9 and Cali two for 13. The system is set up to get more teams from the East Coast. Unfortunately, as others have posted, this does dilute the field at Nationals. For this year's 16's, I believe Milwaukee VBC is good enough to go to Nationals. Unfortunately, with more East Coast teams coming to the Chicago qualifier, they missed out on a bid and now have to cancel their annual trip to the SCVA boys classic and go to the East Coast qualifier to try and get a bid. I didn't do an actual count, but another factor that promotes more East Coast teams getting bids is that more East Coast teams come to the Midwest events, where almost none of the Midwest teams go out East. For the East Coast teams that get bids in the Chicago qualifier, this potentially knocks out deserving Midwest teams and allows more trickle down in the East coast events. As the Cali teams don't seem to travel outside of CA for qualifiers, I'm certain there are more deserving teams that are left out. Remember, this is the National championships, it should have the BEST teams competing, regardless of where they are from. If they really think they deserve a shot at nationals, then they should come out to East Coast Championships. No one is stopping them from coming to the east coast.
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Post by baywatcher on Apr 20, 2014 5:18:11 GMT -5
Lot of travel for a volleyball tournament. You think this is womens NCAA (nobody travels to Cali) or what?
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Post by gr8hands on Apr 20, 2014 7:20:44 GMT -5
I get your point but as an example Coastal's 16-2 team won a bid at the BECC and almost knocked balboa bay 16's out of the BJNC. You never what's going to happen. And teams do improve by the end of the season. Nationals is a 36 team tournament so the last 6 teams are going to struggle whether they are from CA or VA. If any Californian teams want to come take one of our bids, then let them. The talent level drops off significantly after the top 8 or 10 teams in CA as well. Losing to a team 25-20, 25-16 on the first day of BJNC is considered "almost knocking them out of the tournament"? Coastal 16-2 would have taken over the 2nd seed in the tournament if Diablo would have finished the deal instead of choking up 24-21 on balboa. So technically Diablo almost knocked balboa out of the tournament but coastal would have come off 1st day one and taken over the no. 2 seed in the tournament. The point is a team from the right coast that got a bid at becc was in the mix at bjnc. They came in seeded 35th and took over the 17th seed day one. It's unfortunate that everyone can't be on the same high school schedule.
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Post by rhinovb14 on Apr 20, 2014 10:08:21 GMT -5
Some east coast teams travel to midwest and even Cali (eden for example) to experience vball outside the teams we always play.....what's stopping a team that wants a bid coming to the east coast?
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kerk
Freshman
Posts: 56
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Post by kerk on Apr 20, 2014 17:42:49 GMT -5
Some east coast teams travel to midwest and even Cali (eden for example) to experience vball outside the teams we always play.....what's stopping a team that wants a bid coming to the east coast? My guess would be spring high school volleyball season, for one.
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Post by future on Apr 20, 2014 19:25:51 GMT -5
Last year's BJNC 16's: lowest CA team finished 21st (out of 36). 22nd thru 36th was 8 teams from Midwest and 6 from East coast. Top 21 only saw 4 from Midwest and 2 from East Coast. East Coast has four bid tourn for potential 12 bids, Midwest has two for 9 and Cali two for 13. The system is set up to get more teams from the East Coast. Unfortunately, as others have posted, this does dilute the field at Nationals. The East Coast has 4 Bid Tourneys Rochester, Nittany/Northeastern, Florida and Richmond. The first 3 are all held in Jan and early Feb.....all plently of dates for teams around the country to travel to and do not conflict with Spring HS ball. Boys Volleyball on the East Coast stretches from Massachusetts all the way to Puerto Rico. Just a bit more that San Diego to San Franciso or St. Louis to Chicago. I would wager the travel budgets of clubs like Pace,Eden , Yorktowne and Coastal to name a few, are probably much higher than most of the Bid winning teams from the Midwest and West Coast. Why? Because they want and need to travel to play the best and it sure is nice to have multiple tourneys to go to in order to play good teams.For this year's 16's, I believe Milwaukee VBC is good enough to go to Nationals. Unfortunately, with more East Coast teams coming to the Chicago qualifier, they missed out on a bid and now have to cancel their annual trip to the SCVA boys classic and go to the East Coast qualifier to try and get a bid. I didn't do an actual count, but another factor that promotes more East Coast teams getting bids is that more East Coast teams come to the Midwest events, where almost none of the Midwest teams go out East. For the East Coast teams that get bids in the Chicago qualifier, this potentially knocks out deserving Midwest teams and allows more trickle down in the East coast events. As the Cali teams don't seem to travel outside of CA for qualifiers, I'm certain there are more deserving teams that are left out. Remember, this is the National championships, it should have the BEST teams competing, regardless of where they are from. There were a number of years that North Shore Milwaukee brought their teams to East Coast Championships......love seeing them there this year
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Post by future on Apr 20, 2014 19:27:34 GMT -5
Some east coast teams travel to midwest and even Cali (eden for example) to experience vball outside the teams we always play.....what's stopping a team that wants a bid coming to the east coast? My guess would be spring high school volleyball season, for one. [ b] Not for the 3 other East Coast Tourneys and St. Louis Qualifier .....all held in Jan and Feb. [/b] [/font]
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Post by future on Apr 20, 2014 19:30:57 GMT -5
Just for example. Out of this group of teams in the upcoming tournament REALLY deserve a bid? You speak a both is ut growing the game. I want more teams than your 10 clubs coming. I want that list two 5 times that. That's why we need one big tournament just like Chicago this year. This is just the 16’s age group but I feel like I could put this down for every age group. Braddock Road Capital Sliders 16 Coastal B16 Gold Coastal B16 White FRVBC B161 LIVBC 16 Regl Gold LIVBC 16 Regl Blue MVC B16-Kyle Ocean Bay 16 Quick OVC 16 Green Roch PaceBootleggr161 RVC 16-2 16 Regionals 16 Regionals Southtowns 16's Upward RH Boys warren sixpak 16-1 warren sixpak 16 north Victor VBC 16- T5 YORK RVC 16-1-T5 YORK NVVA FIRE 16-3RD YORK LIVBC 16 National-T9 in SCVC Eden Mizuno 16-T-3 Rochester Coastal B16 Navy-1ST NETLYNX don't know the details of Matt Anderson's recruiting story or his teams bid winning history. But I do not believe teams that win bids at this tournament do well at Nationals. I do not believe they belong in the tournament UNDER THIS FORMAT. I wouldn't call Warren 16's and PAce 16's bad teams......they haven't had their complete teams togehter at any point this year. The Milwaukee MVC has always been a very repectable club at Nationals throughout the years
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Post by future on Apr 20, 2014 19:46:26 GMT -5
East coast should change to a Super tournament like Chicago just did. I suggest doing it at Spooky Nook. I admit the logistics need A LOT of work. BUT, It has potential and is in the middle of most of the east coast teams. Its just 3 east coast tournaments allowing for 9 bids with a total of 20-25 of the exact same teams qualifying for nationals. Look, going up to Nationals and trying is cool. But don't bring the 9th best east coast team out of 25 that register for the 3 tournaments. This would be a terrible idea. So essentially the Club season would be over with one not-so-gigantic tourney at some newbie facility in York pa.? I look at the 3 nice Qualifers being spaced out as a Powerleague with the opportunity to play teams from Canada, Puerto Rico, and Chicago and this is especially true for the 17 and 18's divisions. Have you bothered to look at the 14's division for East Coast Championships? It used to be in the 6-8 teams 10 years ago and it stands at 22 teams this year. I'm sorry that some teams can't participate due to HS Spring ball but I'm NOT sorry that East Coast teams head to the West Coast and Midwest and "STEAL" bids and that some feel this is unfair because it gives a less deserving East Coast Team a shot at a Open Bid. If anything I'm grateful that these teams went out there to help the sport and help seeding......cross regional play is crucial. Thank goodness we have clubs like Ultimate, LIVBC, HP St.Louis, Coastal, Pace, Eden, Yorktowne etc. . Isn't it nice they can expose their players to the National scene and DI coaches all around the country and not just at Nationals
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Post by rhinovb14 on Apr 20, 2014 19:56:34 GMT -5
Yup and yup.....talent all over the country. If these kids weren't afforded these opportunities, why play vball? I look at that gold medal squad from 2008. Awful lot of geographical regions represented. Future hits on the head.....he has been doing this a long time and knows the ins and outs. If you want those bids, hit the east qualifiers in winter. Can am is a fun tournament!
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Post by rightcoast on Apr 22, 2014 4:43:48 GMT -5
Cross seeding is great. I agree the only way to get east coast teams respect is going out and playing west coast teams. I just feel nationals is about getting the best teams to the tournament. Growing the game is for clubs not for the national championship tournament. I just believe finding the best is about eliminating, not including. The biggest problem is high school ball being played at different times during the year. No continuity no chance for boys to repeat what the girls do. My original point about ECC is that it is a third tournament of 20-25 of the same teams with a few new teams sprinkled in vying for a 9th bid. I love ECC as a quasi national warm up. But there is no doubt it rewards very mediocre teams into nationals.
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Post by rhinovb14 on Apr 22, 2014 5:40:27 GMT -5
I think with an increase in the number of teams, and quality programs attending east coasts you may see a lessening of this effect.
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Post by eastcoastvolleyball on Apr 22, 2014 10:04:20 GMT -5
Regarding poor performance by EC teams at nationals, a ton of good east coast teams lost players to the YNT. Colby Harriman, Christy Blough, Kyle Dagostino, Chris Nugent, Aidan Albrecht, Curtis Stallings, Alex Pia, etc., were all huge contributors to their teams and their teams suffered without them at nationals
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