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Post by dunninla on Jan 13, 2015 1:03:50 GMT -5
Inky all the way. Burgess in my view isn't even a first team AA until she can terminate out of system, and Bugg isn't even the best setter in college.
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Post by beachbomb on Jan 13, 2015 1:14:00 GMT -5
Yo Buckshot... most of Burgess' kills this season were out of system... when they were in system they set the middle which is why Inky led the team in KPS and kills
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Post by C on Jan 13, 2015 1:56:06 GMT -5
Inky all the way. Burgess in my view isn't even a first team AA until she can terminate out of system, and Bugg isn't even the best setter in college. Your comment about Burgess is completely wrong. Just Stop. No one even said or has ever said that Bugg is the best setter in college. Seriously though, stop.
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Post by C on Jan 13, 2015 2:01:23 GMT -5
If you want to have a conversation about the best player in college volleyball, that is all well and good but if you want to have a conversation about the AVCA POY there are unwritten roles that we need to be aware of. - As has been mentioned, they need to make the final four. The last player to win the Award without playing in the final four is Stacy Gordon in 2004, who went out in the regional final with 44 kills in a 5 set match. She had 7+ kpg that season, one of 5 players to ever do that (her and Willoughby took POY), and They made her share the award. That's a pretty high standard and one that I'm not sure Carlini specifically, as a setter, has the ability to meet. - 6 of the last 7 winners were Seniors and looking at the AVCA releases back to 1996 NO underclassman has won the award (correction 1 has, Ceparo). -Since Christina Houghtelling, who had been bothered by injuries, each POY had already been an All-American before their POY season, so you can pretty much focus on the returning AA's when figuring this out. -Stacy Gordon is also the last player not from the Pac 10/12, Nebraska or Penn State to win the honor. Players from Hawaii and Long Beach have won in the past but I think you need to prove that you are legit and not a product of a week schedule. -After Pavan, Akinradewo and Fawcette, there have been 6 winners in a row who have been 6 rotation players. Apparently Holman isn't playing, so she is out. Who is unlikely to be going to the final four? Lauren Carlini, Jocelyn Birks and Macey Gardner Who will still be an underclassman? Ali Franti, Rhamat Alhassan, Haleigh Washington, MK Marshall Who has not been an AVCA AA yet? Megan Courtney Who needs a beefy schedule to overcome not being from Penn State, Nebraska or the Pac 12? Chiaka Ogbogu, Alex Holston, Nicole Walsh, Alexa Grey Who doesn't play 6 rotations? Aiyana Whitney Inky Ajanakou Ebony Nwanebou Which leaves us with... Madi Bugg Jordan Burgess (and if you are a believer in USC, Sam Bricio) Of course, as my broker tells me "past results are no guarantee of future performance" so fee free to come to your own conclusions. Couple things to note--Fawcett was 6 rotations as a senior. Nwanebu will most likely play 6 rotations next year as well. And as far as Bricio and Nwanebu, I did forget about those two, but both of those would fall into the category of players unlikely to be at the Final Four. I also wouldn't categorize Carlini as unlikely to play in the Final Four. Outside of Penn State and Stanford, I don't see any teams you can make a strong argument that they'll be better than Wisconsin next year. The only other ones that I believe will be on par are Nebraska (big if with new setter and inconsistent middles), and Texas (who stockpiles talent but consistently underperforms). Actually, for that matter, I'd throw Birks in that group too, as Illinois will be LOADED next year and has Poulter running things along with their great libero, Birks and Stadick returning. Interesting that you don't think that Nwanebu and Bricio, who's team returns almost everyone, are unlikely to be at the Final Four, but think that Carlini, who's team loses a bunch of seniors, will be there.
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Post by bballnut90 on Jan 13, 2015 14:25:13 GMT -5
Couple things to note--Fawcett was 6 rotations as a senior. Nwanebu will most likely play 6 rotations next year as well. And as far as Bricio and Nwanebu, I did forget about those two, but both of those would fall into the category of players unlikely to be at the Final Four. I also wouldn't categorize Carlini as unlikely to play in the Final Four. Outside of Penn State and Stanford, I don't see any teams you can make a strong argument that they'll be better than Wisconsin next year. The only other ones that I believe will be on par are Nebraska (big if with new setter and inconsistent middles), and Texas (who stockpiles talent but consistently underperforms). Actually, for that matter, I'd throw Birks in that group too, as Illinois will be LOADED next year and has Poulter running things along with their great libero, Birks and Stadick returning. Interesting that you don't think that Nwanebu and Bricio, who's team returns almost everyone, are unlikely to be at the Final Four, but think that Carlini, who's team loses a bunch of seniors, will be there. USC went 16-16 last season and has no one coming in to fix their setting/middle problems. Wisconsin finished 31-3, won the B1G and brings in the top class in the country...
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Post by vbnerd on Jan 13, 2015 15:09:04 GMT -5
Washington loses their coach. Arizona and UCLA are losing thier big guns and Oregon State loses 4 starters. USC Returns two of the better players in the country. I can see where some people think USC gets a seed next year and we all saw Nwanebu hit for 30 kills with no errors in a tournament match. I'm not buying it myself but it isn't crazy.
Wisconsin is viable, but losing Thompson requires a system change in a lot of ways. Thompso, Chapman and Morales weren't window dressing, those were really solid players.KT Kvas is a great culture kid. Mikaelsen walked out the door and into a pro contract, so taking her out of the gym is probably a bigger hit than most people realize too. Wisconsin CAN make the final four if about 15 things all go right but that requires betting on a bunch of kids who are still in high school at the moment. I don't think that is a conversation worth having at this point (January) or at least until they get to campus. You have Stanford, Penn State, Nebraska, Florida and Texas who are all loaded for bear and really don't have an excuse not to be there.
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Post by timduckforlife on Jan 13, 2015 15:24:19 GMT -5
Washington loses their coach. Arizona and UCLA are losing thier big guns and Oregon State loses 4 starters. USC Returns two of the better players in the country. I can see where some people think USC gets a seed next year and we all saw Nwanebu hit for 30 kills with no errors in a tournament match. I'm not buying it myself but it isn't crazy. Wisconsin is viable, but losing Thompson requires a system change in a lot of ways. Thompso, Chapman and Morales weren't window dressing, those were really solid players.KT Kvas is a great culture kid. Mikaelsen walked out the door and into a pro contract, so taking her out of the gym is probably a bigger hit than most people realize too. Wisconsin CAN make the final four if about 15 things all go right but that requires betting on a bunch of kids who are still in high school at the moment. I don't think that is a conversation worth having at this point (January) or at least until they get to campus. You have Stanford, Penn State, Nebraska, Florida and Texas who are all loaded for bear and really don't have an excuse not to be there. Only problem here is when you mention the P12, is that you left Oregon off the list. And they also return almost everyone. Granted, I don't think they have a PoY candidate. Big darkhorse would be Bettendorf who took huge strides last year, and if she can become that 6 rotation OPP, she has a chance provided Oregon gets there, but then they have probably a better chane of Arizona, UCLA, OSU, and USC of getting there.
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Post by Longhorn20 on Jan 13, 2015 15:29:48 GMT -5
Interesting that you don't think that Nwanebu and Bricio, who's team returns almost everyone, are unlikely to be at the Final Four, but think that Carlini, who's team loses a bunch of seniors, will be there. USC went 16-16 last season and has no one coming in to fix their setting/middle problems. Wisconsin finished 31-3, won the B1G and brings in the top class in the country... Their biggest problem by far was setting and then passing. Their passing got SIGNIFICANTLY better over the course of the year and they bring in a top 5 setter in their freshman class. I think they will be MUCH better next year.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2015 15:35:50 GMT -5
Washington loses their coach. Arizona and UCLA are losing thier big guns and Oregon State loses 4 starters. USC Returns two of the better players in the country. I can see where some people think USC gets a seed next year and we all saw Nwanebu hit for 30 kills with no errors in a tournament match. I'm not buying it myself but it isn't crazy. Wisconsin is viable, but losing Thompson requires a system change in a lot of ways. Thompso, Chapman and Morales weren't window dressing, those were really solid players.KT Kvas is a great culture kid. Mikaelsen walked out the door and into a pro contract, so taking her out of the gym is probably a bigger hit than most people realize too. Wisconsin CAN make the final four if about 15 things all go right but that requires betting on a bunch of kids who are still in high school at the moment. I don't think that is a conversation worth having at this point (January) or at least until they get to campus. You have Stanford, Penn State, Nebraska, Florida and Texas who are all loaded for bear and really don't have an excuse not to be there. agree with a lot of this except for Texas. Bell and Eckerman aren't that easily replaced and they run such a slow/high system that is a disadvantage to their good athletes... After the Badgers run to the final, most folks on here thought they wouldn't be a top team this season. So after this season, I'm not surprised there are questions, again, to how they will perform next year.
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Post by Wiswell on Jan 13, 2015 16:02:23 GMT -5
While I think the committee of our peers was a little pessimistic on Wisconsin's chances in 2014, I have to agree with them on 2015. It's a group of 6 unproven freshman who have to replace 7 seniors, ALL of whom had significant playing experience throughout their careers, not just 3 playing seniors and 4 butt-splinter pickers.
I like vbnerd's analysis, but despite the history of POY criteria I would pick Haleigh Washington.
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Post by SportyBucky on Jan 13, 2015 16:47:56 GMT -5
I just think Courtney has that chance. Let's face it, it has been Micha's team, and IMO, now it becomes Meghans team. And while there might be more people with more talent than her. Not that she doesn't have amazing talent and skills, but she also has one of the most important things, time and experience. She has put in the time and needs to take that next step and lead her team on another title run. I think she can do it. And I think next year she gains that consistency that propels her teams. Granted thats just my opinion among a sea of opinions. And again, I think the only 2 teams, at this point, that you can really point to being F4 teams are PSU and Stanford. Thus, Courtney and Inky are my 2 picks. You are forgetting about Washington who based on last season is going to put up as good or better numbers as anyone in the country. I'd bet on her before Courtney Don't count on it....Micha and her setting and offensive threat pulling blockers, is gone.
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Post by SportyBucky on Jan 13, 2015 16:49:37 GMT -5
Couple things to note--Fawcett was 6 rotations as a senior. Nwanebu will most likely play 6 rotations next year as well. And as far as Bricio and Nwanebu, I did forget about those two, but both of those would fall into the category of players unlikely to be at the Final Four. I also wouldn't categorize Carlini as unlikely to play in the Final Four. Outside of Penn State and Stanford, I don't see any teams you can make a strong argument that they'll be better than Wisconsin next year. The only other ones that I believe will be on par are Nebraska (big if with new setter and inconsistent middles), and Texas (who stockpiles talent but consistently underperforms). Actually, for that matter, I'd throw Birks in that group too, as Illinois will be LOADED next year and has Poulter running things along with their great libero, Birks and Stadick returning. Interesting that you don't think that Nwanebu and Bricio, who's team returns almost everyone, are unlikely to be at the Final Four, but think that Carlini, who's team loses a bunch of seniors, will be there. Carlini has best libero in the country and returns her two top passers in Morey and Bates. She also has the top recruiting class in the country. She also picked up an HM AA on one of the pins. I think it's possible. My prediction, barring shennanigans by the committee (again), Stanford, NE and PSU will be there, too.
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Post by Longhorn20 on Jan 13, 2015 16:49:55 GMT -5
You are forgetting about Washington who based on last season is going to put up as good or better numbers as anyone in the country. I'd bet on her before Courtney Don't count on it....Micha and her setting and offensive threat pulling blockers, is gone. Yeah it's not like she was the number one recruit or anything.
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Post by c4ndlelight on Jan 13, 2015 16:54:54 GMT -5
You are forgetting about Washington who based on last season is going to put up as good or better numbers as anyone in the country. I'd bet on her before Courtney Don't count on it....Micha and her setting and offensive threat pulling blockers, is gone. Yeah, but Washington could actually be fully healthy for the whole season.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 13, 2015 17:04:38 GMT -5
Don't count on it....Micha and her setting and offensive threat pulling blockers, is gone. Yeah, but Washington could actually be fully healthy for the whole season. ya'll think she's well rounded enough to be POY? I don't, not at this point in her career. Gifted athlete, with a terminal slide...but her blocking and defense is weak. RR has called this out a few times, plus she never hits in front of the setter. She seems a bit too one dimensional at this point to be in consideration. (I'm sure she'll improve her weaknesses during the off season though.)
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