|
Post by notperfect on Jun 11, 2018 19:03:53 GMT -5
This is a very challenging issue to deal with. One of the major perks of AAUs is that you don't have to qualify for any division, so you can make travel arrangements 7 months ahead to cut costs. However, because they do not control over what division you are allowed to play in, they do not limit teams from dropping down. There is no easy fix for this or it would have probably been done. It's basically the honor system of playing in the correct division but some clubs care more about having inflated numbers on their website than challenging their athletes. These are the teams that win a division without dropping a set. In theory you could say if a team wins a division without dropping a set, that team would have to play up a level the next year, but because the team may not return the same players, that might be unfair if they lose a few of their best players and are forced to play above their level. So again, there is still no easy fix. You would hope that the athletes/parents/coaches/club directors would care more about challenging their athletes than winning trophies, but that is not always the case. My thought is that you play up in every tourney you can and play the toughest competition possible during the "regular season", medals are inconsequential. However by the time nationals rolls around you know where you would do best and play the division you fit in in an attempt to win it all. This is not always possible with 18's but it is with every other division.
|
|
|
Post by notperfect on Jun 11, 2018 19:07:28 GMT -5
Interesting point of view! I was agreeing with MagnOlia and eazy until I read your post. Now I don't know what to think. I think the clubs have your philosophy perhaps thinking we have no chance for gold or even top 5 in the higher division even though we competed pretty well all year.
|
|
|
Post by stevehorn on Jun 11, 2018 21:10:36 GMT -5
I apologize for the off topic veer but so,ething I read triggered me on something that drives me nuts The trend where teams play open for league but play down in large tournaments. I'm looking at a few of you in the Chicago area, you know who you are. That may be a reason why the # of team in open divisions are dropping. I suspect there needs to be some regulation when it comes to crossing down in divisions. Maybe allow teams to play up for the competition aspect and getting better but not allow teams to play down.
A team may be capable of playing open in the region, but not in a national tournament. In USAV, open teams in the national tournament finished in the top 2 or 3 at a national qualifier except for a couple of at large teams. A number of teams play open in the qualifiers, don't win an open bid, but win a bid to a lower division in the regional bid tournaments (or other process).
|
|
|
Post by eazy on Jun 11, 2018 21:13:14 GMT -5
This is a very challenging issue to deal with. One of the major perks of AAUs is that you don't have to qualify for any division, so you can make travel arrangements 7 months ahead to cut costs. However, because they do not control over what division you are allowed to play in, they do not limit teams from dropping down. There is no easy fix for this or it would have probably been done. It's basically the honor system of playing in the correct division but some clubs care more about having inflated numbers on their website than challenging their athletes. These are the teams that win a division without dropping a set. In theory you could say if a team wins a division without dropping a set, that team would have to play up a level the next year, but because the team may not return the same players, that might be unfair if they lose a few of their best players and are forced to play above their level. So again, there is still no easy fix. You would hope that the athletes/parents/coaches/club directors would care more about challenging their athletes than winning trophies, but that is not always the case. My thought is that you play up in every tourney you can and play the toughest competition possible during the "regular season", medals are inconsequential. However by the time nationals rolls around you know where you would do best and play the division you fit in in an attempt to win it all. This is not always possible with 18's but it is with every other division. I think the “you fit in” is the most important part. If you are are beating the heck out of people on day 4, you don’t really fit in. I’m totally for teams playing up during the year to getting ready for the competition they’ll see on day4 to win it all, and dropping a division if they have no shot to win a higher division. But, you shouldn’t go into nationals being 99% sure you’re going to win it all.
|
|
|
Post by notperfect on Jun 11, 2018 21:39:02 GMT -5
I agree. It would be a pretty empty feeling to move down and blow out teams who were nowhere close to you during the rest of the year
|
|
|
2018 AAUs
Jun 12, 2018 0:16:47 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by trainermch on Jun 12, 2018 0:16:47 GMT -5
I agree. It would be a pretty empty feeling to move down and blow out teams who were nowhere close to you during the rest of the year You don’t “move down.” You were “playing up” to challenge the team most of or the entire season. The reward for all that beating you took is to finally play at your level and maybe win the championship. Not a bit empty. Quite the opposite to be exact.
|
|
|
Post by eazy on Jun 12, 2018 0:37:01 GMT -5
I agree. It would be a pretty empty feeling to move down and blow out teams who were nowhere close to you during the rest of the year You don’t “move down.” You were “playing up” to challenge the team most of or the entire season. The reward for all that beating you took is to finally play at your level and maybe win the championship. Not a bit empty. Quite the opposite to be exact. Here’s a hypothetical of what I think we are advocating against. Imagine if Wisconsin was a D3 school that was allowed to play D1 postseason. They could compete in the B1G regular season and be near the top. But any year that they don’t win the B1G they drop down to D3 postseason and easily win the championship. Should they be proud of that?
|
|
|
Post by maɡˈnōlēə on Jun 12, 2018 3:45:37 GMT -5
Team in question is a 1's team, plays Super Open in GLPL, has several other teams lower. Strong, capable players. Consistently plays down when a trophy is at stake thus making the club look good because these strong capable players play down when hardware is on the line. Disingenuous. This isn't a 4's team playing up all season to elevate their skills. This is a consistent 1's team at a moderately sized club. I'm not sure it's beneficial to the players ultimately. But the club sure looks good.
|
|
|
Post by volleypsq on Jun 12, 2018 8:15:49 GMT -5
Team in question is a 1's team, plays Super Open in GLPL, has several other teams lower. Strong, capable players. Consistently plays down when a trophy is at stake thus making the club look good because these strong capable players play down when hardware is on the line. Disingenuous. This isn't a 4's team playing up all season to elevate their skills. This is a consistent 1's team at a moderately sized club. I'm not sure it's beneficial to the players ultimately. But the club sure looks good. Yes and said club is up to 12 National championships that way. They will prob win a couple more in premier and club this year.
|
|
|
Post by vbforever2 on Jun 12, 2018 8:24:17 GMT -5
There should be more uncertainty in outcomes due to many seniors already joining their college teams, correct? I heard from a reliable source that Munciana 18s has had more than one key player depart for college early. Could have a potential impact on the team.
|
|
|
2018 AAUs
Jun 12, 2018 8:26:14 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by jasonr on Jun 12, 2018 8:26:14 GMT -5
There should be more uncertainty in outcomes due to many seniors already joining their college teams, correct? I heard from a reliable source that Munciana 18s has had more than one key player depart for college early. Could have a potential impact on the team. I know that Miller is already at Nebraska. What about Parker, Hernandez, and Rosenthal?
|
|
|
Post by trainermch on Jun 12, 2018 8:41:02 GMT -5
You don’t “move down.” You were “playing up” to challenge the team most of or the entire season. The reward for all that beating you took is to finally play at your level and maybe win the championship. Not a bit empty. Quite the opposite to be exact. Here’s a hypothetical of what I think we are advocating against. Imagine if Wisconsin was a D3 school that was allowed to play D1 postseason. They could compete in the B1G regular season and be near the top. But any year that they don’t win the B1G they drop down to D3 postseason and easily win the championship. Should they be proud of that? I will let you figure that out. I am talking about high school athletes.
|
|
|
2018 AAUs
Jun 12, 2018 9:26:57 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by maɡˈnōlēə on Jun 12, 2018 9:26:57 GMT -5
I think eazy was simply drawing a parallel to what I was making a point about. This is not regarding teams that play up to broaden their skills and challenge them go back to their usual level. This is about a club that,with regularity, will situate their 1's team lower than they should given their usual level of play.
|
|
|
Post by rainbowbadger on Jun 12, 2018 9:42:35 GMT -5
Hey, notperfect - can you please change the title of the thread (just edit your original post) to add "2018 AAUs" - since this is going to be the topic, it makes sense and will be easier to find. BuckysHeat or someone who's good with this, can you post the AES/schedule link for AAUs? Thanks to both.
|
|
|
Post by notperfect on Jun 12, 2018 11:04:36 GMT -5
Thanks good idea. I didn't know it could be done and if you didn't tell me how, would never have figured it out.
|
|