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Post by robvolei on Mar 27, 2024 3:45:55 GMT -5
Javi 5'11 and Joaquim 6' and 1/2". Avg. height = 5'11.75
Lochhead 5'10 and Kirk Pitman 6'4. Avg. height = 6'1.
Huber 5'11 and Seidl 6'3. Avg. height = 6'1.
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Post by mrknuckle on Mar 27, 2024 4:30:37 GMT -5
How about this: Really small teams should start each set with a 2-0 lead, and really tall teams start with a -2 deficit! Would make for a much broader set of players in the sport, better competition, more fun for all. Someone call FIVB.
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Post by guest2 on Mar 27, 2024 6:16:21 GMT -5
How about this: Really small teams should start each set with a 2-0 lead, and really tall teams start with a -2 deficit! Would make for a much broader set of players in the sport, better competition, more fun for all. Someone call FIVB. I'd love to see a cumulative team height limit, must average 6'4 or less or something like that.
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Post by bvblove on Mar 27, 2024 11:30:07 GMT -5
Great ideas, lol
But we should also talk about how these small players usually have that ‘something else’ that makes them so successful.
How many tall blockers are just tall (intimidating but not much more) vs those small ones who have great technique, vision, physicality (vertical jump)…. If someone has access to beach data or similar, I would love to see the stats…
Recife best blockers (only mesures block points, which I know is not all, but a good indication): -Marco Kratigger 34 (impressive 8.5/match) -Alayo 30 (5/match) -Joaquin Bello 30 (5/match)
With same number of matches (stats are cumulative) Evandro (20), Budinger (17)
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Post by burnabyjo on Mar 27, 2024 15:03:15 GMT -5
To take the opposite side, it was likely their first time playing in Asia, besides a long trip they took to Russia last year. First tournament of the year where they got beat in 2 by "Lousy Austrian team" who is actually Swiss Krattiger/Breer. We don't know what their preparation or travel looked like going to Doha for that qualifier but I would think nothing about playing for the Cuban federation is easy. Also, if you simply select their worst events and ignore their best results you could make almost any team look far better or worse than they truly are. Spanked by Evandro sure, but the best server in the world for nearly a decade was crushing every team with his serve? Let me select some of their nice results. At Tlaxcala WCH they beat Perusic/Schweiner who won the event just a few days later. At the Pan am games they beat Andre/George (good team or no?) in pool play, took Smith/Webber for an educational beatdown in the semis, then lost to Andre/George 13-15 in the final. At Itapema challenger last year and only their second event on world tour aside from WCH they beat Crabb/Sander, Pedophile/Immers and then Renato/Vitor before finishing 4th. Also good enough to take a set from Stoya/Leshukov in Russian tour last September. Lost it 21-16 7-21 8-15 ouch... I recall you saying similar stuff about the Bellos last fall after their challenger success, so I expect more solid results from this Cuban team. Maybe not next event in Saquarema, but it could be later in the year. Let's see how they do! When you mention Smith/Webber, Crabb/Sander, and a World Championships pool match in their list of top accomplishments you make my point for me. Also I didn't cherry pick their "worst results" I referred to basically every FIVB event they have played. If someone were saying, "looks like they have a good chance to be a good Challenge team" no issue there, but people are throwing around things like podium contender at Elite level. As for the Bellos, nice event for them, what exactly have they proven? The best team they have beaten in FIVB play in their entire partnership is Treo. (You know the team that is 0-for lifetime in Elite events). As mentioned in another thread there are about 20-30 Challenge level teams, who are all ok, but kind of blah and they just trade wins with one team posting a few strong finishes, then another. Any one of them can make a final and you aren't surprised, but also not surprised when they end up in a Challenge Q after a few weak results. But actually look at the Bellos match record in their nice recent run. Basically playing .500 against non Q teams. Solid, but in their last 5 FIVBs + the CEV they have also lost to Cuba, Spain, Austria 1 and 2, Ukraine, Portugal, Lithuania. I never said beating Sander and Webber were their top accomplishments, I mentioned those teams in a list of a few playoffs wins when they had good finishes. I don't see why you downplay that they able to beat Perusic/Schweiner at the world champs. Yes it was only pool play but surely the Czech guys were doing everything they could to win their first game. 1. Ahman 2. Mol 3. Mol 4. Mol 5. Partain 6. Cherif 7. Gavira 8. Alayo/Diaz 9. Evandro 10. Nicolai 11. Nicolai 12. Cherif 13. Immers 14. Mol Those are all the teams that have beaten Perusic/Schweiner since the start of 2023 season. Looks like the young Cubans are sitting in good company. I wouldn't be surprised if they have a let down this weekend after a high last weekend.
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Post by guest2 on Mar 27, 2024 19:27:01 GMT -5
When you mention Smith/Webber, Crabb/Sander, and a World Championships pool match in their list of top accomplishments you make my point for me. Also I didn't cherry pick their "worst results" I referred to basically every FIVB event they have played. If someone were saying, "looks like they have a good chance to be a good Challenge team" no issue there, but people are throwing around things like podium contender at Elite level. As for the Bellos, nice event for them, what exactly have they proven? The best team they have beaten in FIVB play in their entire partnership is Treo. (You know the team that is 0-for lifetime in Elite events). As mentioned in another thread there are about 20-30 Challenge level teams, who are all ok, but kind of blah and they just trade wins with one team posting a few strong finishes, then another. Any one of them can make a final and you aren't surprised, but also not surprised when they end up in a Challenge Q after a few weak results. But actually look at the Bellos match record in their nice recent run. Basically playing .500 against non Q teams. Solid, but in their last 5 FIVBs + the CEV they have also lost to Cuba, Spain, Austria 1 and 2, Ukraine, Portugal, Lithuania. I never said beating Sander and Webber were their top accomplishments, I mentioned those teams in a list of a few playoffs wins when they had good finishes. I don't see why you downplay that they able to beat Perusic/Schweiner at the world champs. Yes it was only pool play but surely the Czech guys were doing everything they could to win their first game. 1. Ahman 2. Mol 3. Mol 4. Mol 5. Partain 6. Cherif 7. Gavira 8. Alayo/Diaz 9. Evandro 10. Nicolai 11. Nicolai 12. Cherif 13. Immers 14. Mol Those are all the teams that have beaten Perusic/Schweiner since the start of 2023 season. Looks like the young Cubans are sitting in good company. I wouldn't be surprised if they have a let down this weekend after a high last weekend. No the Czechs weren't doing everything they could to win. If they were doing everything they could to win, they would have won. The WC structure is so lousy the Czechs didnt just phone in their first match against Cuba, they basically forfeited their final pool match to Evandro. In pool the Czechs played 5 games against professional teams. They lost 4 of them by margins of 4 points or more. Why were they able to do that? Because they had an amateur Mexican team in their pool so they were 100% certain of advancement.
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Post by burnabyjo on Mar 27, 2024 21:30:48 GMT -5
I never said beating Sander and Webber were their top accomplishments, I mentioned those teams in a list of a few playoffs wins when they had good finishes. I don't see why you downplay that they able to beat Perusic/Schweiner at the world champs. Yes it was only pool play but surely the Czech guys were doing everything they could to win their first game. 1. Ahman 2. Mol 3. Mol 4. Mol 5. Partain 6. Cherif 7. Gavira 8. Alayo/Diaz 9. Evandro 10. Nicolai 11. Nicolai 12. Cherif 13. Immers 14. Mol Those are all the teams that have beaten Perusic/Schweiner since the start of 2023 season. Looks like the young Cubans are sitting in good company. I wouldn't be surprised if they have a let down this weekend after a high last weekend. No the Czechs weren't doing everything they could to win. If they were doing everything they could to win, they would have won. The WC structure is so lousy the Czechs didnt just phone in their first match against Cuba, they basically forfeited their final pool match to Evandro. In pool the Czechs played 5 games against professional teams. They lost 4 of them by margins of 4 points or more. Why were they able to do that? Because they had an amateur Mexican team in their pool so they were 100% certain of advancement. Pool play they played 5 games? Are you maybe referring to sets? I would still disagree they are ok with losing pool games 10/6-15 Tlaxcala, Mexico David Schweiner 16 1 $30,000.00 800 PI: l. Jorge Alayo / Noslen Diaz (33) 17-21, 21-15, 9-15 (0:45) PI: d. Isaias Aguirre / Ricardo Galindo (40) 21-11, 21-8 (0:28) PI: l. Evandro Goncalves / Arthur Mariano (9) 16-21, 17-21 (0:38) W1: d. Pablo Herrera / Adrian Gavira (17) 21-19, 21-17 (0:44) W2: d. Daniele Lupo / Enrico Rossi (25) 21-15, 21-17 (0:41) W3: d. Anders Mol / Christian Sorum (1) 21-14, 14-21, 15-12 (0:50) SF: d. Theo Brunner / Trevor Crabb (21) 21-15, 21-12 (0:35) G: d. David Ahman / Jonatan Hellvig (2) 21-15, 17-21, 15-13 (0:56)
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Post by COVAlove on Mar 27, 2024 22:39:41 GMT -5
Great ideas, lol But we should also talk about how these small players usually have that ‘something else’ that makes them so successful. How many tall blockers are just tall (intimidating but not much more) vs those small ones who have great technique, vision, physicality (vertical jump)…. If someone has access to beach data or similar, I would love to see the stats… Recife best blockers (only mesures block points, which I know is not all, but a good indication): -Marco Kratigger 34 (impressive 8.5/match) -Alayo 30 (5/match) -Joaquin Bello 30 (5/match) With same number of matches (stats are cumulative) Evandro (20), Budinger (17) When you consider the skills that are common for most small players making any impact at the world tour level it’s obvious why they are usually so fun to watch and cheer for. They have to have amazing ball control, superb defense, immaculate shots, beautiful hands, and high game IQ.
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Post by guest2 on Mar 28, 2024 5:34:47 GMT -5
No the Czechs weren't doing everything they could to win. If they were doing everything they could to win, they would have won. The WC structure is so lousy the Czechs didnt just phone in their first match against Cuba, they basically forfeited their final pool match to Evandro. In pool the Czechs played 5 games against professional teams. They lost 4 of them by margins of 4 points or more. Why were they able to do that? Because they had an amateur Mexican team in their pool so they were 100% certain of advancement. Pool play they played 5 games? Are you maybe referring to sets? I would still disagree they are ok with losing pool games 10/6-15 Tlaxcala, Mexico David Schweiner 16 1 $30,000.00 800 PI: l. Jorge Alayo / Noslen Diaz (33) 17-21, 21-15, 9-15 (0:45) PI: d. Isaias Aguirre / Ricardo Galindo (40) 21-11, 21-8 (0:28) PI: l. Evandro Goncalves / Arthur Mariano (9) 16-21, 17-21 (0:38) W1: d. Pablo Herrera / Adrian Gavira (17) 21-19, 21-17 (0:44) W2: d. Daniele Lupo / Enrico Rossi (25) 21-15, 21-17 (0:41) W3: d. Anders Mol / Christian Sorum (1) 21-14, 14-21, 15-12 (0:50) SF: d. Theo Brunner / Trevor Crabb (21) 21-15, 21-12 (0:35) G: d. David Ahman / Jonatan Hellvig (2) 21-15, 17-21, 15-13 (0:56) Sets and games are the same thing. If they weren't ok with losing irrelevant pool matches then explain the disparity in these records: Pool - 1-4 against Challenge teams (all lost games by 4 or more points) Playoffs - 10-2 against a mix of Challenge and Elite teams. 6-0 against Challenge teams.
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