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Post by Norah Sus on Nov 21, 2024 12:52:39 GMT -5
A ton of retired players do commentate, and some of them are absolutely awful. I still think majority of them do better than the ones we have now. And if we go down to the D2 and D3 levels it is just god awful. I'm talking they sya bump, set, spike and get confused about simple calls. I agree! They almost need a little cheat sheet in front of them as to what each referee signal means. They never know what the call is on an illegal back row attack, for example, but it has a very clear hand signal from the ref. |
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Post by ineedajob on Nov 21, 2024 13:02:19 GMT -5
It is disappointing to see the number of male commentators who really don't know much about the sport and make inappropriate comments about the players. We need to get retired players commentating. When Lauren Stivrens commentated at Nebraska she did great and was able to add insight into the nature of Nebraska Volleyball. TLDR version: The "male commentator" is usually the play-by-play person. It usually isn't the play-by-play person's job to know much about volleyball. The color commentator (usually an ex-player or ex-coach, and usually female) is the one who is supposed to be offering analysis. There is a huge difference in the roles of the person doing play-by-play and the person doing color commentary/analysis. Sports play-by-play is its own field - the person filling that role is not responsible for the knowledge about whatever sport they're covering (including all the rule nuances), as they will often do play-by-play of numerous sports. A volleyball exception to that is Paul Sunderland. To my knowledge, he only does volleyball play-by-play. He also played volleyball, and knows/follows volleyball better than most color commentators. The field of "sports play-by-play" is inherently a male-dominated field, so we're going to hear a lot of males in that role. There are some exceptions. Courtney Lyle is a wonderful example in sports play-by-play that we hear in volleyball, but I don't believe she would ever claim to be a "volleyball expert." I also think she's terrific at calling basketball. Beth Mowins is another well-known example of a female who does sports play-by-play. Their role is not offering knowledge or hardcore analysis of the sport, but to describe the action and then set up and rely on their color commentator for analysis. By no means are play-by-play people above criticism, but they should not be faulted if they don't offer great volleyball analysis. The color commentator is supposed to be the person that offers insight and analysis. This is an area that is severely lacking in volleyball. It is usually an ex-player or ex-coach who should know the ins-and-outs of volleyball, but doesn't. Criticize them for the lack of volleyball knowledge presented in a telecast. |
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Post by austintatious on Nov 21, 2024 13:04:38 GMT -5
Most, especially when they are doing remote coverage, they are watching the monitora and never see the signals,but yes, when on site no excuse to xheck signal at end of rally.
I think I posted a week or 2 ago that whether explayers/coaches, or others, need to have training classes in off season or extensive preseason.
1. when to comment, when to hush
2. learn to condense thoughts that fit in the finite time between serices.
3. educate yout play by play person if they slip up, they should appreciate it, even if in post match debrief.
4. lose cliches
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gbr33
Junior High
Posts: 1 
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Post by gbr33 on Nov 21, 2024 13:05:48 GMT -5
NAIA says hold my beer. A NAIA school in Nebraska has a boomer who calls their games and refers to all tips as "dinks". It's brutal.
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Post by mervinswerved on Nov 21, 2024 13:40:28 GMT -5
It is disappointing to see the number of male commentators who really don't know much about the sport and make inappropriate comments about the players. We need to get retired players commentating. When Lauren Stivrens commentated at Nebraska she did great and was able to add insight into the nature of Nebraska Volleyball. I'd say the vast majority of analysts are women, including all of the ones who get high profile matches. If you're complaining about male play-by-play announcers, pxp is an entirely different skill set, in my opinion. Most of them went to school for it, and ex-coaches or ex-players don't get nearly enough reps to do it well. I have been broadcasting for several years and only in the last couple have I felt comfortable doing something as simple as taking us into break or bringing us out of one. Let alone managing the narrative flow of the match, dealing with the storyboard, or skillfully setting up a color commentator. |
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Post by mervinswerved on Nov 21, 2024 13:41:35 GMT -5
It is disappointing to see the number of male commentators who really don't know much about the sport and make inappropriate comments about the players. We need to get retired players commentating. When Lauren Stivrens commentated at Nebraska she did great and was able to add insight into the nature of Nebraska Volleyball. TLDR version: The "male commentator" is usually the play-by-play person. It usually isn't the play-by-play person's job to know much about volleyball. The color commentator (usually an ex-player or ex-coach, and usually female) is the one who is supposed to be offering analysis. There is a huge difference in the roles of the person doing play-by-play and the person doing color commentary/analysis. Sports play-by-play is its own field - the person filling that role is not responsible for the knowledge about whatever sport they're covering (including all the rule nuances), as they will often do play-by-play of numerous sports. A volleyball exception to that is Paul Sunderland. To my knowledge, he only does volleyball play-by-play. He also played volleyball, and knows/follows volleyball better than most color commentators. The field of "sports play-by-play" is inherently a male-dominated field, so we're going to hear a lot of males in that role. There are some exceptions. Courtney Lyle is a wonderful example in sports play-by-play that we hear in volleyball, but I don't believe she would ever claim to be a "volleyball expert." I also think she's terrific at calling basketball. Beth Mowins is another well-known example of a female who does sports play-by-play. Their role is not offering knowledge or hardcore analysis of the sport, but to describe the action and then set up and rely on their color commentator for analysis. By no means are play-by-play people above criticism, but they should not be faulted if they don't offer great volleyball analysis. The color commentator is supposed to be the person that offers insight and analysis. This is an area that is severely lacking in volleyball. It is usually an ex-player or ex-coach who should know the ins-and-outs of volleyball, but doesn't. Criticize them for the lack of volleyball knowledge presented in a telecast. I posted my reply before reading yours. Totally agree. I will add one thing about good color work. We always try to treat our audience like they aren't morons, but we very quickly try to get past what is happening in the match and more towards why it's happening. As a former coach someone who watches an outrageous amount of sports on television, I work with our broadcast team to educate our viewers but never talk down to them. |
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Post by dizzydean on Nov 21, 2024 13:42:49 GMT -5
It is disappointing to see the number of male commentators who really don't know much about the sport and make inappropriate comments about the players. We need to get retired players commentating. When Lauren Stivrens commentated at Nebraska she did great and was able to add insight into the nature of Nebraska Volleyball. I'd say the vast majority of analysts are women, including all of the ones who get high profile matches. If you're complaining about male play-by-play announcers, pxp is an entirely different skill set, in my opinion. Most of them went to school for it, and ex-coaches or ex-players don't get nearly enough reps to do it well. I have been broadcasting for several years and only in the last couple have I felt comfortable doing something as simple as taking us into break or bringing us out of one. Let alone managing the narrative flow of the match, dealing with the storyboard, or skillfully setting up a color commentator. Speaking of set-ups, no one is clunkier that Sunderland (who is generally good). "30th missed serve by Stanford. Is that a good thing, Holly?" "Franklin with her 24th kill of the match. Holly would you keep setting her?" |
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Post by hipsterfilth on Nov 21, 2024 13:44:47 GMT -5
I was once watching an Illinois boys' state championship match -- one of the teams had an All-American middle and not much else, so they would absolutely drain points whenever he was back-row / not at the net and just catch back up whenever he rotated to the front. There were two male commentators probably college-aged who literally did not even know that the players have to rotate on the court. When said team would drain points with the middle in the back row, they would speak so negatively about the head coach like to the point of literally berating her coaching style ON THE AIR with things like "I have no idea what she's thinking. She has to put him back in the match, they're going to lose this way" or "how can you just let these points drain by with your best player on the bench? this is befuddling!"  Interestingly, and unsurprisingly, they never once said anything about the opposing male head coach "forcing" his best OH to play back row for half the match. |
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Post by volleysota on Nov 21, 2024 13:53:48 GMT -5
I still think majority of them do better than the ones we have now. And if we go down to the D2 and D3 levels it is just god awful. I'm talking they sya bump, set, spike and get confused about simple calls. I agree! They almost need a little cheat sheet in front of them as to what each referee signal means. They never know what the call is on an illegal back row attack, for example, but it has a very clear hand signal from the ref. I actually made a similar commentary about what a play by play person should know, or do their homework on, before a volleyball match. I don't expect them to be volleyball experts, but I don't consider it unreasonable to know the names of the players, basic rules, ref hand signals, some volleyball lingo and background info on the teams/players. |
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Post by Norah Sus on Nov 21, 2024 14:00:05 GMT -5
and for god's sake, look into the pronunciation of their names!!
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Post by volleysota on Nov 21, 2024 14:04:10 GMT -5
and for god's sake, look into the pronunciation of their names!! This too. I don't know if every school does it, but at least for the Gophers, they have an audio clip of each player saying their name on their roster page. And even if they don't, it shouldn't be too difficult for media to reach out to the athletic department to get a pronunciation guide. |
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Post by mervinswerved on Nov 21, 2024 14:09:17 GMT -5
and for god's sake, look into the pronunciation of their names!! This too. I don't know if every school does it, but at least for the Gophers, they have an audio clip of each player saying their name on their roster page. And even if they don't, it shouldn't be too difficult for media to reach out to the athletic department to get a pronunciation guide. I cannot count how many times a coach pronounces a player's name one way, the pronunciation guide has it a second way, and the SID has it a third. At that point, I usually go up to the kid during warm-ups and ask her how she likes to say her name, then I go with that. |
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Post by hipsterfilth on Nov 21, 2024 15:02:03 GMT -5
Ok so speaking of bad announcers:
I'm watching Michigan's semifinals right now and there's a dude who commentates all of the matches every year -- he's FINE, def has gotten better with the years, but regularly makes the wrong call...
but, if you listen to the video, the woman in the auditorium is COMICALLY AWFUL and you can hear her over his announcing. She literally calls it either a kill or an attacking error every single time. She'll go "attack error, X team" when the player gets a kill off the block... like X team gets a kill and it hits the block on the way out and she calls the team that just got the point for an attacking error... she means blocking error for the OTHER team... but, even worse, even when a team gets an ACE she also says that's an attacking error for the receiving team. So, an "attacking error" by her logic can get you a point or your opponent a point depending on the scenario. I'm crying.
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Post by coachk2 on Nov 21, 2024 15:18:35 GMT -5
This too. I don't know if every school does it, but at least for the Gophers, they have an audio clip of each player saying their name on their roster page. And even if they don't, it shouldn't be too difficult for media to reach out to the athletic department to get a pronunciation guide. I cannot count how many times a coach pronounces a player's name one way, the pronunciation guide has it a second way, and the SID has it a third. At that point, I usually go up to the kid during warm-ups and ask her how she likes to say her name, then I go with that. In NAIA volleyball where CK does play by play, always have the many international players directly say their name to me pre-match (just get there early) đđ€ Almost never do the coaches nor SIDâs have it quite right and donât want their families to think I donât know how to say itđ«Ł Although all time favorite pronunciation correction was at a GJNCâs Final when a TAV Mom came out of the stands and re-wrote over coachâs version of her daughterâs name phonetically on my roster minutes before start of matchđł She said: âI have been telling him ALL YEARâ đ |
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Post by timduckforlife on Nov 21, 2024 18:34:35 GMT -5
It is disappointing to see the number of male commentators who really don't know much about the sport and make inappropriate comments about the players. We need to get retired players commentating. When Lauren Stivrens commentated at Nebraska she did great and was able to add insight into the nature of Nebraska Volleyball. It's not only male commentators. I remember listing to a pvf match with Omaha vs someone. Guy commentator was an idiot, was more interested in who the ladies were dating, and the female commentators said Oregon was good, but couldn't stand the court and wouldn't watch it because the teams shorts, they were unwomanly or something like that, completely stupid commentation. Let alone the fact that the Oregon lets their ladies wear whatever they want including leggings.
And yes, she was a retired Nebraska player, so its not about that, it's about knowledge people commenting about the game, and not the length of shorts or who is dating whom.
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