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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2020 0:38:33 GMT -5
I think Larson and Hill are The existence of both Ting & KYK disqualifies this as a possibility. Pick one or the other! Is KYK still #2? She was --unquestionably-- the top player in the world from like 2011-2014, but is she still that high?? I'm not sure. I think Hill and Larson have been more successful since London.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2020 0:41:43 GMT -5
Goncharova is an Oppo. She doesn't pass and hits mostly Ds or Red (right side). Her goofy footed approach limits her to hit that way. If she tries to hit line, she will develop shoulder problems. She doesn't hit wrist away, you're right. But she does hit line when she hits bodyline. She's an oppo though, through and through. They set her OOS because she's a stud, but that doesn't make her an OH.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2020 0:42:27 GMT -5
The existence of both Ting & KYK disqualifies this as a possibility. Pick one or the other! Is KYK still #2? She was --unquestionably-- the top player in the world from like 2011-2014, but is she still that high?? I'm not sure. I think Hill and Larson have been more successful since London. She was better than either of them during the World Cup. She's still #2.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2020 0:46:44 GMT -5
Her goofy footed approach limits her to hit that way. If she tries to hit line, she will develop shoulder problems. She doesn't hit wrist away, you're right. But she does hit line when she hits bodyline. She's an oppo though, through and through. They set her OOS because she's a stud, but that doesn't make her an OH. No one said she was an OH. You're still confused, man.
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Post by Hawk Attack on Apr 19, 2020 0:54:15 GMT -5
The existence of both Ting & KYK disqualifies this as a possibility. Pick one or the other! Is KYK still #2? She was --unquestionably-- the top player in the world from like 2011-2014, but is she still that high?? I'm not sure. I think Hill and Larson have been more successful since London. Maybe #3... I could entertain arguments that she's only #3, but only with convincing arguments that there's a clear #2 ahead of her. Personally I'm steadfast she's #2. I'm more interested in hearing who you would put in there with Ting/KYK (assuming only one can make it), Hill or Larson? Or just order all 4 and explain why. I'd like to read some opinions
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2020 0:55:54 GMT -5
Is KYK still #2? She was --unquestionably-- the top player in the world from like 2011-2014, but is she still that high?? I'm not sure. I think Hill and Larson have been more successful since London. She was better than either of them during the World Cup. She's still #2. Being better at one event = being better overall. Got it. Also didn't realize that we were only considering NT performances.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2020 1:11:20 GMT -5
She was better than either of them during the World Cup. She's still #2. Being better at one event = being better overall. Got it. Also didn't realize that we were only considering NT performances. They all played against the same teams within the same (recent) time frame. You have a better recent lab for direct comparison? What do you think Hill/Larson do better than KYK? She passed better than both: KYK 2.35, Larson 2.29, Hill 2.23. She hit better than either; KYK 44.1%, Larson 40.9%, Hill 34%. She blocked better than them too; KYK +35.3, Larson +16.6, Hill 0 (meaning she had one bad touch for every good touch). Hill did serve slight better than KYK, but Larson was third best in that regard. What's your case for either Larson or Hill being better than KYK?
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Post by gibbyb1 on Apr 19, 2020 1:13:25 GMT -5
I guess you misunderstood my question. I never said we needed them at every position. I didn't say we needed them at all. I simply asked if you thought we had any top 3 players at their respective positions and, if so, which ones. I'm still curious how you'd answer the question. Okay. I think Larson and Hill are and I think Carlini and Ogbogu could be. MBH and Robinson are probably top-10. Plummer should be entering her third summer starting on the national team, but isn't, so we can't count her. Not in any order, my opinion of the top OHs in the world: Natalia, Mihajlovic, Zhu Ting, Larson, Hill, Robinson, Barstch, Martinez, KYK. Sylla and Plak are in the conversation, on any given day. Buijs, Pietrini, that one from Turkey, the L2 for China probably make up the next tier. You think Larson and Hill are two of the best three lefts in the world??? I have to disqualify you from any and all judgements on Carlini because your are the Fox News to her Donald Trump. For what it’s worth I don’t disagree Carlini could at some point be a top 3 player . She’s that good
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2020 1:17:36 GMT -5
Is KYK still #2? She was --unquestionably-- the top player in the world from like 2011-2014, but is she still that high?? I'm not sure. I think Hill and Larson have been more successful since London. Maybe #3... I could entertain arguments that she's only #3, but only with convincing arguments that there's a clear #2 ahead of her. Personally I'm steadfast she's #2. I'm more interested in hearing who you would put in there with Ting/KYK (assuming only one can make it), Hill or Larson? Or just order all 4 and explain why. I'd like to read some opinions #1 Zhu #2 Larson #3 Club Hill #4 Natalia #5 KYK #6 Brankica #7 Robinson #8 Bartsch #9 Changning #10 Gabi #11-20 Sylla, Plak, Martinez, Buijs, Parubets, Voronkova, Baladin, DLC, Bricio, Koga? Idk man it's late.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2020 1:24:32 GMT -5
Being better at one event = being better overall. Got it. Also didn't realize that we were only considering NT performances. They all played against the same teams within the same (recent) time frame. You have a better recent lab for direct comparison? What do you think Hill/Larson do better than KYK? She passed better than both: KYK 2.35, Larson 2.29, Hill 2.23. She hit better than either; KYK 44.1%, Larson 40.9%, Hill 34%. She blocked better than them too; KYK +35.3, Larson +16.6, Hill 0 (meaning she had one bad touch for every good touch). Hill did serve slight better than KYK, but Larson was third best in that regard. What's your case for either Larson or Hill being better than KYK? And there's where you're wrong: the three of them didn't play all the same teams. USA rotated their four OHs in and out of the lineup regularly. Possibility of a bunch of other factors influencing those numbers, including the fact that Hill took most of 2019 off and only returned for the WC, too right? What were Hill's numbers at Club World Championships?
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Post by gibbyb1 on Apr 19, 2020 1:32:10 GMT -5
Maybe #3... I could entertain arguments that she's only #3, but only with convincing arguments that there's a clear #2 ahead of her. Personally I'm steadfast she's #2. I'm more interested in hearing who you would put in there with Ting/KYK (assuming only one can make it), Hill or Larson? Or just order all 4 and explain why. I'd like to read some opinions #1 Zhu #2 Larson #3 Club Hill #4 Natalia #5 KYK #6 Brankica #7 Robinson #8 Bartsch #9 Changning #10 Gabi #11-20 Sylla, Plak, Martinez, Buijs, Parubets, Voronkova, Baladin, DLC, Bricio, Koga? Idk man it's late. It is late.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2020 1:33:43 GMT -5
They all played against the same teams within the same (recent) time frame. You have a better recent lab for direct comparison? What do you think Hill/Larson do better than KYK? She passed better than both: KYK 2.35, Larson 2.29, Hill 2.23. She hit better than either; KYK 44.1%, Larson 40.9%, Hill 34%. She blocked better than them too; KYK +35.3, Larson +16.6, Hill 0 (meaning she had one bad touch for every good touch). Hill did serve slight better than KYK, but Larson was third best in that regard. What's your case for either Larson or Hill being better than KYK? And there's where you're wrong: the three of them didn't play all the same teams. USA rotated their four OHs in and out of the lineup regularly. Possibility of a bunch of other factors influencing those numbers, including the fact that Hill took most of 2019 off and only returned for the WC, too right? What were Hill's numbers at Club World Championships? Is that a better competition in which to judge them side by side, do you think? And you didn't tell me what you think either Hill or Larson do better than KYK.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2020 1:47:01 GMT -5
And there's where you're wrong: the three of them didn't play all the same teams. USA rotated their four OHs in and out of the lineup regularly. Possibility of a bunch of other factors influencing those numbers, including the fact that Hill took most of 2019 off and only returned for the WC, too right? What were Hill's numbers at Club World Championships? Is that a better competition in which to judge them side by side, do you think? And you didn't tell me what you think either Hill or Larson do better than KYK. Well, it is a more recent competition in which to judge them. Probably not fair though... KYK had to hit off Lloyd 😳 What do Hill and Larson do better? They win, I guess. I think that they've both been more successful at the club level since London than KYK has. Medals should be part of the comparison, in addition to stats, don't you think?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2020 2:00:50 GMT -5
Is that a better competition in which to judge them side by side, do you think? And you didn't tell me what you think either Hill or Larson do better than KYK. Well, it is a more recent competition in which to judge them. Probably not fair though... KYK had to hit off Lloyd 😳 What do Hill and Larson do better? They win, I guess. I think that they've both been more successful at the club level since London than KYK has. Medals should be part of the comparison, in addition to stats, don't you think? No, actually. I think (where applicable) individual performances are a better indication of individual ability. Things like hitting and passing and blocking and serving. Team performances are a better indication of team ability. Things like winning and medals. But if that's the metric you're using, I can see why you'd think Larson/Hill are better. I won't dispute that with you. The same argument is sometimes made to justify Terry Bradshaw or Troy Aikman as great QBs but, like KYK over Larson or Hill, give me Dan Marino any day.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2020 2:50:49 GMT -5
Well, it is a more recent competition in which to judge them. Probably not fair though... KYK had to hit off Lloyd 😳 What do Hill and Larson do better? They win, I guess. I think that they've both been more successful at the club level since London than KYK has. Medals should be part of the comparison, in addition to stats, don't you think? No, actually. I think (where applicable) individual performances are a better indication of individual ability. Things like hitting and passing and blocking and serving. Team performances are a better indication of team ability. Things like winning and medals. But if that's the metric you're using, I can see why you'd think Larson/Hill are better. I won't dispute that with you. I think sustained team success in multiple different locations playing with different teammates and different coaches says quite a bit about the individual. That doesn’t fit with your narrative, though, so it makes sense that you reject it. Still waiting for the numbers from Club World Championships btw.
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