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Post by mervinswerved on Sept 29, 2021 10:37:41 GMT -5
Because the Biden Administration is breaking international and (probably) US law by terrorizing them at the border and deporting thousands of them. I'm sure his party will hold him accountable. I'm sure they won't! The administration's position is pretty mainstream in American politics.
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Post by AmeriCanVBfan on Sept 29, 2021 10:38:14 GMT -5
Actually my blindshot is based on the reaction by the government turning people away. Because you... trust the government so much? That seems to be entirely against other views you've expressed on this forum. I guess now abandoned your "proper processing" stance, and are now hanging your hat on "don't enter the country by 'illegal means,'" when entering the country without permission isn't a bar to seeking asylum! Did I say that I was against the Haitian people coming across if they had a right to? You are saying that there is a difference in their set of circumstances and of those who do "enter the country by illegal means". I am fully willing to accept that. I still wonder why they are being turned away in such a visible and forceful way if it is wrong to do so. Merv says the government is wrong to do so but there has been no alteration in their course of action.
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Post by mervinswerved on Sept 29, 2021 10:40:44 GMT -5
Merv says the government is wrong to do so but there has been no alteration in their course of action. Because the executive branch is always interested in doing the right thing? News to me. This is at least the fourth administration in a row with a terrible immigration/border enforcement policy.
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Post by donut on Sept 29, 2021 10:55:10 GMT -5
You didn't respond to anything written in my actual post, but ok. Because you... trust the government so much? That seems to be entirely against other views you've expressed on this forum. I guess now abandoned your "proper processing" stance, and are now hanging your hat on "don't enter the country by 'illegal means,'" when entering the country without permission isn't a bar to seeking asylum! Did I say that I was against the Haitian people coming across if they had a right to? I don't know. Your usage of "rights" and "legal rights" in this thread is confusing. Not really. I'll ask again: so you trust the government in this sphere to do this right thing? And lol, I'll give you one reason: xenophobia and racism. Ok, I guess that's two.
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Post by donut on Sept 29, 2021 10:57:37 GMT -5
Not only is it contradictory to other views expressed, but "the government is doing X, so X must be right" is also a glaringly bad logical fallacy.
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Post by mervinswerved on Sept 29, 2021 11:04:50 GMT -5
I could never imagine a Democrat like Joe Biden would immiserate and brutalize poor people and/or migrants to look tough and secure his political flanks.
Not the architect of the 1984 and 1994 crime bills, nope no way.
Or the guy who just dropped a Hellfire missile on a bunch of Afghan children, for that matter.
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Post by AmeriCanVBfan on Sept 29, 2021 11:46:10 GMT -5
Ok I'll try and answer a few things...
I'm not sure why Biden would try and "look tough" when I have always perceived his political base as wanting the opposite of that.
Xenophobia and racism were accusations leveled towards the previous administration. I'm surprised that they would come into play with this administration.
I do not place a huge amount of trust in government regardless of who's in charge but I try and give them the benefit of the doubt. If people are allowed to cross in the manor the Haitians are then I don't understand why the Biden admin is taking the course of action that they are.
ALSO... I'm not saying that if the government is doing X, X must be right. I'm saying there must have/should have been a reason for X.
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Post by AmeriCanVBfan on Sept 29, 2021 11:54:04 GMT -5
Dunc I'm very sorry... I'm pretty sure I meant to ask "Are you saying that there is a difference blah blah blah..." my bad on that one.
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Post by donut on Sept 29, 2021 12:08:18 GMT -5
Ok I'll try and answer a few things... I'm not sure why Biden would try and "look tough" when I have always perceived his political base as wanting the opposite of that. Xenophobia and racism were accusations leveled towards the previous administration. I'm surprised that they would come into play with this administration. Ok cool? Uhhhhhh lol And those (bad) reasons have been provided to you.
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Post by donut on Sept 29, 2021 12:08:36 GMT -5
Dunc I'm very sorry... I'm pretty sure I meant to ask "Are you saying that there is a difference blah blah blah..." my bad on that one. I don't know what you're asking.
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Post by donut on Sept 29, 2021 12:09:45 GMT -5
Dude, to be frank, you're grasping at straws after getting caught talking out of your a$$. You've repeatedly been rebutted and repeatedly changed your position.
Maybe, for the fourth time, do some research on US and international asylum law, and then come back for a conversation that goes beyond "illegal bad."
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Post by mervinswerved on Oct 4, 2021 13:59:01 GMT -5
Another Biden Administration official out the door in protest. This time, a political appointee rather than career fed.
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Post by mikegarrison on Oct 4, 2021 14:21:09 GMT -5
It's a good question. Why are we not accepting these refugees?
I understand when xenophobic, selfish assh*les like Trump refuse to accept refugees. But why Biden?
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Post by AmeriCanVBfan on Oct 4, 2021 15:28:46 GMT -5
It's a good question. Why are we not accepting these refugees? I understand when xenophobic, selfish assh*les like Trump refuse to accept refugees. But why Biden? From the little that I have read, it seems like this less of a Trump/Biden thing and more of a "historical precident". For whatever reason the US has often given a cool reception to Haitian immigrants compared to other Cuban or West Indian immigrants. www.coha.org/disparities-in-u-s-immigration-policy-toward-haiti-and-cuba-a-legacy-to-be-continued/
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Post by mervinswerved on Oct 4, 2021 15:32:24 GMT -5
It's a good question. Why are we not accepting these refugees? I understand when xenophobic, selfish assh*les like Trump refuse to accept refugees. But why Biden? It's pretty much the default position of the American government. Certain groups are worthy of legal status and certain groups aren't. I imagine if the Haitian refugees snuck across the border and just started living here without papers, the Biden administration wouldn't be in a hurry to round them up and deport them. But then of course they wouldn't be refugees, legally at least. By presenting themselves for asylum and trying to gain legal refugee status, they created a situation the federal government doesn't naturally want to deal with any other way than terrorizing and then deporting them. It does seem, though, like Biden is happy to continue exercising the previous administration's new found legal authority (title 42) just like Trump was happy to continue Obama's drone program.
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