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Post by vballstartedit on Jun 8, 2021 20:19:25 GMT -5
While the courts ruled the AVP was at fault and should have paid the appearance fees, here's my take on the whole thing (which permanently changed how I view one of the best players of all time): Both sides essentially held the same position of "I (we) want to make money from volleyball, therefore growing the game is advantageous." - Which is fine for both a pro tour and pro player. However, when the truth came out (i.e. appearance fees far in excess of what other players could make in an entire season), well... one side turned out to be transparent with their intentions. The other side turned out to be "6 Feet of B.S." One side prefaced their "grow the game" position with "We're a business and at the end of the day will act accordingly to protect our interests." The other side apparently prefaced that position with "Everyone should incur risks and make sacrifices, except for me. And I don't care if you own the tour, run everything by me first, because I'm bigger than the game." Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the AVP did have some type of informal players board or council to review rule changes for the Freeze, Kerri just wasn't part of that group. Well said, Graham! You have explained why we all would be incredibly surprised if Donald ever lets her play AVP again (at least, as long as he owns it). Do you think Donald will ever sell AVP?
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Post by goldengirlsx3 on Jun 8, 2021 20:31:34 GMT -5
Well said, Graham! You have explained why we all would be incredibly surprised if Donald ever lets her play AVP again (at least, as long as he owns it). Do you think Donald will ever sell AVP? YES
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Post by david38 on Jun 8, 2021 22:07:13 GMT -5
Do you think Donald will ever sell AVP? YES Any deets on that, or speaking as a hunch?
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Post by sonofdogman on Jun 8, 2021 22:13:10 GMT -5
Any deets on that, or speaking as a hunch? That's a Kerri stan who would climax if Sun sold, so ignore it. I think Donald would certainly sell for the right offer. He is a business man and won't pass up a good deal. Problem is, the AVP hasn't been a good deal for anyone in decades.
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Post by david38 on Jun 8, 2021 22:48:08 GMT -5
Any deets on that, or speaking as a hunch? That's a Kerri stan who would climax if Sun sold, so ignore it. I think Donald would certainly sell for the right offer. He is a business man and won't pass up a good deal. Problem is, the AVP hasn't been a good deal for anyone in decades. Right. I missed a nice chunk of the AVP timeline (really from after Karch to about 3-4 years ago lol) so I'm not too familiar with the struggles, but it's a bit puzzling. I mean, I think it's a great product. I don't know volleyball like I do basketball, where I can watch a game and pick out more of the nuances, but overall, just watching beach typically puts me in a good mood, I would say in a unique way apart from pretty much any other sport. It's such a great vibe; some days I would hate it when the Monster Cup schedule for the day was winding down even though I might have been watching a match I wasn't crazy about, just wanting it to keep going. There must be a key to unlock that vibe and make it successful, although I guess many have made the effort and it hasn't happened. And in goldengirlsx3 defense! I loved your entries from that Las Vegas tourney and then thought we lost you at some point. While there may be some heavy leaning! toward Kerrie, the passion for the game rings true.
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Post by beavis on Jun 8, 2021 23:43:47 GMT -5
While the courts ruled the AVP was at fault and should have paid the appearance fees, here's my take on the whole thing (which permanently changed how I view one of the best players of all time): Both sides essentially held the same position of "I (we) want to make money from volleyball, therefore growing the game is advantageous." - Which is fine for both a pro tour and pro player. However, when the truth came out (i.e. appearance fees far in excess of what other players could make in an entire season), well... one side turned out to be transparent with their intentions. The other side turned out to be "6 Feet of B.S." One side prefaced their "grow the game" position with "We're a business and at the end of the day will act accordingly to protect our interests." The other side apparently prefaced that position with "Everyone should incur risks and make sacrifices, except for me. And I don't care if you own the tour, run everything by me first, because I'm bigger than the game." Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the AVP did have some type of informal players board or council to review rule changes for the Freeze, Kerri just wasn't part of that group. Regardless of the who it is, if a player has a contract with an organization that organization has a legal obligation to fulfill their end of the contract. Kerri had a 5 year contract with the AVP she signed in 2013 for use of her likeness and agreement for certain promotions. Sure other sports organizations will try to negotiate more favorable agreements with players, but can you imagine an NBA team just straight up deciding not to pay a player? It would end up the same result - court finding in favor to the player and organization would be responsible for the player's legal fees (like the AVP was). To me this was such a black and white legal issue, it was so stupid for the AVP to try to not honor the contract. And holy crap the mental gymnastics it takes to turn the AVP not honoring a player's contract into some how that player thinking, "I don't care if you own the tour, run everything by me first, because I'm bigger than the game." Just wow, and this is coming from someone rooting for Sponcil and Claes to earn the Olympic spot. Guessing that Donald and Company had a pretty good reason to think that Kerri had breached her end of the Contract, which justified not paying her. And I'm pretty sure that, in Donald's world, it wasn't about the $150K. Just saying.
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Post by goldengirlsx3 on Jun 9, 2021 7:11:17 GMT -5
Any deets on that, or speaking as a hunch? That's a Kerri stan who would climax if Sun sold, so ignore it. I think Donald would certainly sell for the right offer. He is a business man and won't pass up a good deal. Problem is, the AVP hasn't been a good deal for anyone in decades. In all fairness to me, the question was “Do you think Donald sells the AVP? My answer was YES. Why would you hold on to a business that makes no money and that you are actually losing money on? No one is gonna buy in this economy though.
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Post by ajm on Jun 9, 2021 8:14:47 GMT -5
Regardless of the who it is, if a player has a contract with an organization that organization has a legal obligation to fulfill their end of the contract. Kerri had a 5 year contract with the AVP she signed in 2013 for use of her likeness and agreement for certain promotions. Sure other sports organizations will try to negotiate more favorable agreements with players, but can you imagine an NBA team just straight up deciding not to pay a player? It would end up the same result - court finding in favor to the player and organization would be responsible for the player's legal fees (like the AVP was). To me this was such a black and white legal issue, it was so stupid for the AVP to try to not honor the contract. And holy crap the mental gymnastics it takes to turn the AVP not honoring a player's contract into some how that player thinking, "I don't care if you own the tour, run everything by me first, because I'm bigger than the game." Just wow, and this is coming from someone rooting for Sponcil and Claes to earn the Olympic spot. Guessing that Donald and Company had a pretty good reason to think that Kerri had breached her end of the Contract, which justified not paying her. And I'm pretty sure that, in Donald's world, it wasn't about the $150K. Just saying. Donald may have thought he was justified in not paying her, but apparently the courts didn’t see it that way. Given that a year passed after the first missed payment before the lawsuit was filed, I’m guessing they made efforts to settle their dispute but were unable to do so. In hindsight, both sides lost.
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Post by Semp12 on Jun 9, 2021 10:13:11 GMT -5
While the courts ruled the AVP was at fault and should have paid the appearance fees, here's my take on the whole thing (which permanently changed how I view one of the best players of all time): Both sides essentially held the same position of "I (we) want to make money from volleyball, therefore growing the game is advantageous." - Which is fine for both a pro tour and pro player. However, when the truth came out (i.e. appearance fees far in excess of what other players could make in an entire season), well... one side turned out to be transparent with their intentions. The other side turned out to be "6 Feet of B.S." One side prefaced their "grow the game" position with "We're a business and at the end of the day will act accordingly to protect our interests." The other side apparently prefaced that position with "Everyone should incur risks and make sacrifices, except for me. And I don't care if you own the tour, run everything by me first, because I'm bigger than the game." Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the AVP did have some type of informal players board or council to review rule changes for the Freeze, Kerri just wasn't part of that group. Regardless of the who it is, if a player has a contract with an organization that organization has a legal obligation to fulfill their end of the contract. Kerri had a 5 year contract with the AVP she signed in 2013 for use of her likeness and agreement for certain promotions. Sure other sports organizations will try to negotiate more favorable agreements with players, but can you imagine an NBA team just straight up deciding not to pay a player? It would end up the same result - court finding in favor to the player and organization would be responsible for the player's legal fees (like the AVP was). To me this was such a black and white legal issue, it was so stupid for the AVP to try to not honor the contract. And holy crap the mental gymnastics it takes to turn the AVP not honoring a player's contract into some how that player thinking, "I don't care if you own the tour, run everything by me first, because I'm bigger than the game." Just wow, and this is coming from someone rooting for Sponcil and Claes to earn the Olympic spot. The NFL does it all the time. The Lions legitimately took $1 million back from potentially their GOAT Calvin Johnson after he retired and has had a rift ever since (although some rumors now that the new leadership may be trying to bridge that gap).
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Post by midwestbeachbum on Jun 9, 2021 10:40:12 GMT -5
Gone a few days and miss a good thread... what a shame on my part.
My 2 cents... Kerri can still play and I think she could help a Sara Hughes for a year or two before allowing Sara to go find somebody to hit the road with for the Olympics. I think she knows that this was the last Olympic cycle for her. Go help somebody like Hughes, make up with the AVP, maybe grab a landmark AVP comeback win, and ride off into the sunset by fixing some of the damaged relationships and reminding everyone stateside why she did so well for so many years on the AVP.
Story book kinda ending... yeah... but hey hallmark and disney still make money off of their movies.
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Post by dunninla3 on Jun 9, 2021 11:34:23 GMT -5
From Sara Hughes' perspective, not sure she would want Kerri to play AVP. Hughes can partner with Wilkerson in AVP, and with KWJ for FIVB. As the above poster noted, perhaps do that for a year, then Hughes can see if Kloth, Jones or Van Winden develop enough to partner with her for a Paris run.
Assuming Alix hangs it up to watch Opra and eat bon bons in her new home, April will also be in KWJ's position. No way in hell those two patch up and play. I think Kim Hill would be an awesome April partner if she decides the money and body wear of Indoor needs to stop.
I do not believe that KWJ's current performance would allow KWJ/Hughes to qualify for Paris. KWJ's matches recently have been rife with Option pokeys out, routine in system hits 2' past the back line, routine hits 2' wide of the sideline, etc. etc. It isn't only Brooke that bombed in Ostrava. Regarding her block pull, she was once so much better than every other blocker. That was years ago. Every blocker does serious practice time on that and many are better than KWJ at that skill now. Mentally KWJ still has that fire and focus, but physically the sideout skills have diminished quite a bit. The game moves on. I would pick Clancy over KWJ straight up. If Claes is focused, her too. KWJ might not even be better than Kolinske in 2021.
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Post by david38 on Jun 9, 2021 12:02:06 GMT -5
And who would have thought it on the Claes part of this comment. Wasn't there a time not long ago when whole games would go by without her getting a block; and like Sponcil and also the team as a whole, incredible leaps and bounds improvement in such a short time.
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Post by tamz on Jun 9, 2021 12:11:17 GMT -5
From Sara Hughes' perspective, not sure she would want Kerri to play AVP. Hughes can partner with Wilkerson in AVP, and with KWJ for FIVB. As the above poster noted, perhaps do that for a year, then Hughes can see if Kloth, Jones or Van Winden develop enough to partner with her for a Paris run. Assuming Alix hangs it up to watch Opra and eat bon bons in her new home, April will also be in KWJ's position. No way in hell those two patch up and play. I think Kim Hill would be an awesome April partner if she decides the money and body wear of Indoor needs to stop. I do not believe that KWJ's current performance would allow KWJ/Hughes to qualify for Paris. KWJ's matches recently have been rife with Option pokeys out, routine in system hits 2' past the back line, routine hits 2' wide of the sideline, etc. etc. It isn't only Brooke that bombed in Ostrava. Regarding her block pull, she was once so much better than every other blocker. That was years ago. Every blocker does serious practice time on that and many are better than KWJ at that skill now. Mentally KWJ still has that fire and focus, but physically the sideout skills have diminished quite a bit. The game moves on. I would pick Clancy over KWJ straight up. If Claes is focused, her too. KWJ might not even be better than Kolinske in 2021. Kim Hill has been saying that this is her last year indoor. (She hasn’t signed with any clubs for next season, so Olympics will likely be her last go with USAV) But not too sure about her transitioning to beach either. There were rumors that she and Larson were going to beach but they’ve disputed such rumors. Kim Hill does seem like a good partner for anyone. She’s always so positive.
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Post by pnw_mark on Jun 9, 2021 13:12:52 GMT -5
Could Hughes submit for dual Citizenship with Canada for the sake of being Brandi's partner? I know that's way out there.. but looks like there's quite a long line for blockers in the US.
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Post by dunninla3 on Jun 9, 2021 13:35:27 GMT -5
sort of off topic, but does anyone else wonder how Kolinske would do with a more consistent partner? I am really curious to see what a Kolinske/Hughes pairing would do... I have zero doubt that the results would be better than Kolinske/Stockman. Now that Stockolinske is out for Tokyo...hmmm. Kolinske will get her 2 or maybe 3 blocks per set, Hughes would set her more consistently, plus Hughes would make fewer in system sideout errors.
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